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Am I the only one who finds it offensive and unfair that law students are not all taking the same test under the same conditions?

nope. it's ridiculous. and the accommodations kids routinely end up having a lot of extra time to review. lol... fair system we've got here

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alright but an admissions test where formal preparation correlates strongly with success is already suspicious. more preparation generally leads to faster completion of the logic games section at least, so could the restraints plausibly intensify the advantage rich people with lots of free time enjoy? idk, but always amusing that some will argue that logic games are the most teachable section of the test while simultaneously defending it as some sacred great arbiter of natural skill.

I worked my entire way through Undergrad to pay for it and have 15k debt to show for it. I've never not worked - I study LSAT on weekends after I put in my 8 hours and I'm gonna score a +170 in September. The resources I've used include a PS Bible I bought for $20 off Craigslist, some PTs I bought in bulk and the free explanations available on 7Sage and LSATHacks as well as a couple forums and the LSAT Reddit. You know what's going to suck compared to other potential Ivy candidates? My GPA which I earned while doing 30 hour work weeks. My softs which I have no time to pad up. THANK GOD for the LSAT - the greatest equalizer available to students attempting to go to law school.

The idea that the rich are more advantaged by being able to easily afford retakes or a $700 prep course (which you don't even need to take to score top 1 percentile), but that that advantage is somehow smaller in the other elements of an application when the rich can afford to never have to work through school and have their entire week to devote to class... That they can be selective and informed about where it's easy to pad GPA. Where they can get a tutor (just like LSAT!) for any of their +40 courses or to help them or someone to do writing assignments... it honestly blows my mind that people argue the LSAT is what advantages rich people. It's the fairest part of the admissions process from a poor vs rich person standpoint and that's before even talking into account the benefits of a standardized system in fairness compared to one where sometimes top 1/4 of class is A in one school and where top 1/10 of a similar quality of students is an A in another one.

And of course this all comes before talking about scholarship money. If you're rich you choose a school 4-5 schools higher on the list (assuming you're not already headed for T6) because you don't need the money to survive. For people like me most of our scholarship is going to be funded by the people with worse scores than us who go to the same school and can afford to pay for the difference.

Sorry to ramble. The concept that the LSAT is what advantages rich people has always struck me as a great fall back for people who either aren't willing to put the time in, or don't have the capability to excel at the components being tested (which correlate better than anything else with your ability to do well in 1L and so are a more legitimate than anything else they use to filter students by). As for natural skill - your initial LSAT is a good measure of some of that. Some peoples' colds are 120s, others are high 150s or even low 160s (usually brought down by LG). But the LSAT doesn't measure natural skill, it measures your ability to read, understand and rationalize. Some people will already be better at these skills from the get go or due to their life experience - but as you said it's a teachable exam. They want to take the people strongest and most efficient at those skills - not the people who are naturally best at it the first time they see it. That's the idea behind any admissions isn't it? Natural advantage is helpful, but hard work also impacts the result because you're testing skills and a way of thinking that is meant to be helpful for learning law. Why the hell would you want a test not testing that? Otherwise we'd just take people based on IQ.

Speaking of that... "an admissions test where formal preparation correlates strongly with success is already suspicious" - what admissions test doesn't correlate well with preparation? Is it the GED? The GMAT? The SAT? Those seem pretty suspicious in light of your criticism. The only admission I can think of that would be mostly free of suspicion in your analysis would be for Mensa. Why would you ever want an admissions test that doesn't test learnable content?

Seriously stop with 'hurr durr LSAT good for rich people'. It's up there on the list with 'LSAT only exists cause racism'. As someone poor but driven and reasonably smart it's the only reason I have a shot at improving my position in this life. Ty

my friend, i don't hurr durr the lsat. in fact i share your appreciation to some extent, although mine is much more qualified. it does provide a more even playing field than other aspects of one's application...but that isn't saying much lol. the fact that an lsat prep cottage industry exists is no accident, either. it isn't to reward people with the grit to work hard and study, it's to enrich all the parties that get in on the grift. come on... if you want to be an attorney, you should be able to detach from your emotional sympathy for a test that you're good at and analyze its implications objectively

as others have said, that is not a bad score for a first run through. the emotional ups and downs of practice tests can be rough, especially at the beginning. but don't worry. you don't really know how to take the test yet. the timing, pacing, etc. you figure that stuff out through doing more and more PTs

alright but an admissions test where formal preparation correlates strongly with success is already suspicious. more preparation generally leads to faster completion of the logic games section at least, so could the restraints plausibly intensify the advantage rich people with lots of free time enjoy? idk, but always amusing that some will argue that logic games are the most teachable section of the test while simultaneously defending it as some sacred great arbiter of natural skill

finally listened to this (at least episode 2) and it is unconvincing. he's mad he did bad on the lsat. legit criticisms of the lsat are plenty but his absurd take is that if you process information quickly you don't truly understand it.

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my friend, i don't hurr durr the lsat. in fact i share your appreciation to some extent, although mine is much more qualified. it does provide a more even playing field than other aspects of one's application...but that isn't saying much lol. the fact that an lsat prep cottage industry exists is no accident, either. it isn't to reward people with the grit to work hard and study, it's to enrich all the parties that get in on the grift. come on... if you want to be an attorney, you should be able to detach from your emotional sympathy for a test that you're good at and analyze its implications objectively ....

i just don't get why the LSAT couldn't accomplish the same goal without the logic game component being so hard. i suspect that at basically every level of intellect, you need to invest time and money to synchronize your logic game scores with your RC and LR scores. sure i think it can be done. you just have to pay in time and money. which is good for LSAC prep test sales but pretty lousy if you're low on time and money. i think the GRE verbal section is a good model. analytical questions that assess your aptitude and analytical skills but use a more intuitive format of just reading comp and logical reasoning type q's