You still need to keep doing it; a better way about thinking about it is can you hit within 2-3 points of your target on pt’s consistently? For example, if you score 161, 165, 163 on 3 consecutive pt’s that is theoretically better than scoring 167 once (that’s not to say hitting 167 even once is a big deal but moreso that we want to work up to a point where we can do that consistently).

Honestly don’t think about it too hard and just do it

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GRE would definitely reach the international student market though since compare to the LSAT, the language barrier for GRE is not as significant (at least from what I heard).

Eh based on my experience I would say thbthat language barrier is about the same; I have a few friends at GW Law, for example, who have strong accents and write awkwardly but have scored in the mid 160’s.

GRE is as difficult as LSAT so I don't know about the language barrier, but as mentioned in the blog post, GRE is much more accessible as it is offered in many times in many countries.

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GRE would definitely reach the international student market though since compare to the LSAT, the language barrier for GRE is not as significant (at least from what I heard).

Eh based on my experience I would say thbthat language barrier is about the same; I have a few friends at GW Law, for example, who have strong accents and write awkwardly but have scored in the mid 160’s.

GRE is as difficult as LSAT so I don't know about the language barrier, but as mentioned in the blog post, GRE is much more accessible as it is offered in many times in many countries.

Oh no yeah I agree with that since I’ve taken both. Really a lot of people assume the GRE is easier but I mean there’s no math on the LSAT to begin with so that’s not really true it just depends. They are relatively just as difficult I guess would be the best way to put it- a 165 sage may not be able to even crack 310 if they have subpar math skills.

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GRE would definitely reach the international student market though since compare to the LSAT, the language barrier for GRE is not as significant (at least from what I heard).

Eh based on my experience I would say thbthat language barrier is about the same; I have a few friends at GW Law, for example, who have strong accents and write awkwardly but have scored in the mid 160’s.

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I think the biggest argument for the GRE is for dual degrees (like JD/MBA). I think it makes sense that law schools would accept it in that scenario, allowing applicants to only take a single exam. But otherwise, it makes more sense to take the LSAT.

I agree because in the context of a JD/MBA applicant, having one test is easier. You have to remember though, not all people who score high on the LSAT will necessarily do well on the GRE because the math is actually pretty hard. I’ve seen people hit 165+ who couldn’t crack GRE math and I’ve seen people who nailed the GRE well enough to have a score that converts to a solid LSAT. If you can do the math and want to do a dual degree in a quantitative field then take the GRE. If not, just take the LSAT.

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I took both coming from a stem background.

159Q. 155V.

I prefer the lsat. I like all the reading and argument analysis. I do like preparing for the GRE writing assignment. It is really difficult.

I actually think recognizing the learnable patterns on the lsat makes it more difficult than the GRE .

I am stuck in the low 160s on the lsat. I feel the lsat will better prepare me for law school. Even games.

Yeah that seems to be a fair correlation with your scores based on the ETS conversion tool- you should be in the low to mid 160’s if you’re scored is around 315.

There’s a Harvard article that talks about how “caffeine naps” are beneficial. Basically, a caffeine nap is when you take a quick nap after consuming caffeine. From experience, I’ve taken a lot of mini caffeine naps during long night study sessions. Caffeine pills hit you less instantaneously than orally administered caffeine but definitely can be nice sometimes. It’s recommended to take L-theanine with caffeine as they have a synergy. L-theanine reduces caffeine induced anxiety and nervousness. DLPA is good to take when you’re taking a tolerance break from caffeine because it reduces the withdrawals.

Well I would said that if you’re performing well on LG that is very good. I would hazard a prediction that a lot of people who score lower on the actual LSAT than on their pt’s/BR’s are losing points on logic games. For example, using diagrams in your blind reviews that are not succinct does not help you on test. Anyways, if you’re consistently getting 0 or 1 wrong on the first logical reasoning section and then 6 or 9 wrong on the next then you could just have endurance issues. That or you’re also perhaps taking too long on easy questions or reading over answer choices that you should eliminate faster. Maybe you’ve got to economize on time? Also, you don’t necessarily have to hit 170 in your PT’s to score a 170. Realistically, your odds of scoring 170+ are much greater if you’ve achieved that on that practice tests but you shouldn’t spend forever doing LSAT prep. A 167+ is going to give you a shot at most T14 law schools with the exception of Yale boiling down to luck in the pick of the draw. And you have to remember most people don’t even break 160.

The fastest way to beef up your score is to improve on LR. Logical reasoning is one of the most learnable sections next to logic games and a great way to improve your score given that there are 2 LR.

Powerscore’s LR reasoning bible is very good, IMO.

If you’re desperate to find something at all you could also try some GMAT and GRE questions. The GMAT has a type of question called “critical reasoning” which is very, very similar to LR and it also has reading comprehension. The GRE is the same- it has reading comp passages and questions similar to LR.

Also, I would go back and document the questions you’re missing. Try to see if there are any patterns like you’re missing a lot of LR weaken questions or running out of time on ordering games. Without any insight into where you’re missing points- it’s kind of hard to give substantive feedback. Give us some examples of questions you missed.

Well I’m not quite a 170 sage- I scored a 169/170 on an untimed PT which is my highest PT record- but a close friend of mine is. She spent 2 years studying for the LSAT and eventually scored a 179. Some advice I remember her giving me is that it’s really important that you quickly understand the conclusion in each LR question that has one; sometimes the correct answer is not very apparent so you have to use process of elimination to eliminate other answers; there’s an element of luck in scoring that high. The latter I think is a good point- you may be PT’ing o

165-167 right now but score a 170+ on the actual LSAT if you just get a good test with lots of questions you can work with.

I think he means the essay portion of the LSAT exam. I wouldn’t worry about this section too much because again your total score is what ultimately matters the most. However, for what it’s worth I would keep your essay to 3-5 paragraphs. I got a perfect score on the awa essay section of the GMAT. It definitely helps to view some samples but also read what you write out loud and if you can find a professor whose familiar with the essay type.

Possibly. Ironically, sometimes you get better when you chill out and just take some time off. Go workout, read whatever you want, have a drink and talk to people, eat good food, have great sex.

Absolutely. It’s a high stakes entrance exam so expect that studying for it brings out both the best and worst in people.

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That's very reassuring to know that I'm not the only one struggling with reading these questions on this test. Thank you guys for all your input! @ anything in particular that you've been reading that's helped you with this test? Or just in general? I highly recommend the reading The Economist, as well as Law review articles and scholarly journals. A lot of books out there are just written at a basic level and are designed for the lay reader. For example, lots of self improvement books avoid using high level rhetoric or language. If they did they probably wouldn’t sell to the masses. I think some of it just comes over time too. For example, I know the feeling you’re talking about when a LR stimulus looks really intimidating because of 1 or 2 words you don’t know, because a sentence sounds or expresses a complex idea or even really because there’s a lot of information to take in. I recently cracked open a copy of Powerscore’s LR Reasoning Bible that I hadn’t touched in 2 years. Looking over some questions, I was surprised by much more clearly I was able to understand the stimulus and answer choices. I think some improvement might just come over time; this is why I think it’s better to start LSAT prep when you’re a little.bit younger. But those are just my thoughts everyone’s different after all.

I think it can be good to read older and perhaps somewhat obscure literature; the grammatical style of Shakespeare, for example, can definitely force you to read more actively in an effort to comprehend.

I totally understand your competitive drive to want to score even higher! This is not a bad thing, but at the same time we inevitably want to attend law school right? If you do not score higher, a 166 is still a score to be very proud of yourself for. I went to George Washington University for undergrad and actually most students I met who took the LSAT failed to surpass 160. You have to remember that there other aspects of your candidacy or really personality in general that matter just as much or perhaps more. Did Barrack Obama score a 180 on the LSAT? No. Obama scored around a 167. However, Obama had a profound ability to influence people which was perhaps the causative factor in his successful election.

This happened to me too. If this is happening my guess is that you understand the question stimulus but are ultimately getting the answer choice wrong because you cannot comprehend the answer choices. For example, if you narrow down an assumption question to two answers you may not be able to choose the correct because you don’t understand the answer means.

This is a good question but I think the answers you receive will be varied. For example, a person’s LSAT learning curve could depend on what age they started studying. One friend of mine spent 2 years studying for the LSAT and eventually scored a 179. I myself am 24 and was first exposed to the LSAT when I was 20. Today I am helping tutoring a friend on the test, and although I haven’t really practiced any LSAT questions in a year I’ve noticed that the questions have become a lot clearer. For example, sometimes I would understand what the question stimulus is asking but not understand what the answer choices mean. But now I see everything a lot more clearly- this could just be from doing a lot of reading.

First of all you gotta relax and remember not all PT’s are made equally and that there a variety of factors that could have been attributed to your lower scores. How much sleep did you get in between each pt? Did you work before taking a pt? Have you been eating? Also, a lot of people I feel hype up their pt’s too much. It can be really difficult to curb your enthusiasm so as to stay humble enough to objectively review your pt’s and keep progressing. I remember my friend who got a 179 was finishing up reviewing a pt with me and I was like hey look “only 3 questions wrong on this LR section.” She just frown and was like “okay that’s one time but we need to move on to going over another set of questions.”

I’d give it another month; you should definitely delay. But also keep in mind that you can’t take forever and some point there’s diminishing returns. The LSAT is a major component of the application and it’s important to alott enough time do well on it. But at the same time it’s not the only aspect of your law school application and you should not let it uneccessarily prolong your application. Anything more than. 2 years I would say would yield diminishing. So I’m a student at GW and this girl in my one of my legal writing classes was adamant about going to law school right after undergraduate. She began studying for the exam at the end of her junior year with a private tutor and took the test after four months. She didn’t do very well, scored below 160, but still got into Georgetown Law School. Another girl, a tutor from YLS I met who gave me a free session and later became my friend, took two years to reach her peak on the LSAT. She started studying for the test her sophomore year and ended up scoring a 179 her senior year. All be told, I wouldn’t take anymore than 2 years to study for the test. Even if a 170 doesn’t happen still apply because you never know. For example, I’ve heard a lot people say online with a 165 you’ll have a hard time getting into a t14. That’s not necessarily true as my own experience seeing real people get into T14’s with less then 165 confirms seeing people who were even nonurm get into those sort of schools.

I think we’re all just human and sometimes it’s natural to lie or exaggerate a bit when we’re put on the spot; everyone has a black box after all. Also, I didn’t mean whether people on 7Sage bluff. I would imagine 7Sage is fairly transparent because people are seeking better advice and therefore give more accurate input on their progress.

I would like to add that in terms of relative difficult and the new retake policy for the LSAT, the GMAT is about the same level of difficult as the LSAT relatively speaking. The math on the GRE and GMAT is not to be underestimated; I sat in for a masters class at a really small crappy university 2 years ago to get a taste of an MBA class. Everyone laughed at me and thought the GRE was just geometry but it was very hypocritical because they themselves didn’t even take it and if they did they would at least be in a top 50 program.

Ok so actually I think I can answer this question. The GRE is a great option for prospective law students if they’re applying to law school if they’re already in a masters a program; one of the reasons law schools have decided to make this shift is to facilitate more interdisciplinary opportunities from other schools within a university. For example, if you took the GRE and got into Harvard Kennedy School or even HBS and now want a JD from Harvard Law then submitting your GRE scores makes a lot of sense. If you were a PhD economics student from some other school like Berkeley and want to appply to Yale Law School then taking the GRE makes sense. In terms of it being a lot easier, it’s easier but it’s not that much easier it shouldn’t be taken seriously. I’ve written the LSAT, GMAT and GRE and have to say the GRE was definitely the easiest but not so easy it was a joke. The trade off is that you also have to be good at math to get a high score; so if you scored high on the LSAT that doesn’t necessarily mean you will score high on the GRE if you can’t break say 155 on quant. Don’t give up on the LSAT unless you can’t break your target after about 3 tries. If you haven’t done a masters and just want to be a law student then LSAT is a better test generally speaking.