User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Joined
Apr 2025
Subscription
Free
User Avatar

Friday, Oct 26 2018

sarahmaureenbazir175

Possible to shore up LG points before Nov test?

Hi all,

I'm retaking the LSAT in November. I sat for the September test and received a 162. I prepared really ineffectively and only took about 10 PTs altogether with virtually nonexistent BR. I've since changed those habits. I want to break 170 and I know that my main problem is logic games.

During recent PTs, I'll often go -5 to -7 on LG simply because I've run out of time and can't answer all the questions in the last game. Combined with my performance on LR and RC, I end up with scores in the mid to high 160s (most around 167-168). When I BR, I go -0 on LG and my score is in the high 170s with the occasional 180.

Is it possible to improve enough on speed in LG to shore up the points by the Nov. test? Is it too late to start fool proofing? Should I push the Nov. test to a later date?

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Thursday, Oct 25 2018

Penn is an excellent school with a very strong reputation nationwide. (I also love Philly, so it has that going for it too.)

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Apr 22 2019

I had the starter plan and received a 169.

I think it's really important that, if you have the starter package, you also have access to an adequate number of PTs to use for both full tests and drills. I purchased a few (maybe 4 or 5) "1-10 PT" books published by LSAC. I cannibalized older PTs for drills and used the newer tests for full exams.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Apr 22 2019

I don't know if a certificate will be the thing that pushes you into the admitted pile - it certainly won't hurt you, either. Since you'll still be in college for another year, just try to work on getting your GPA up as much as possible and building closer relationships with your professors so that you can have more compelling rec letters.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Apr 22 2019

When I was working through the CC, I would drill by question type using the PowerScore workbook that sorts LR by type. My drills had 15 questions or so - if I didn't get all 15 correct, then I'd do another 15, and so on.

Try to strip away detail and find structure. Reduce arguments to their skeletons and you'll see that so many stimuli are saying the same thing, just gussied up differently. For example, you'll always come across questions that make a conditional statement about a person/place/object and then draw a conclusion about a different person/place/object by flipping the conditionality - the answer is always "mistakes a necessary condition for a sufficient condition." Doesn't matter if it's talking about how all teachers are good with children or how all cats love fish or how every car in Townsville is red, the structure is the same.

For what it's worth, the muscle memory I associate with LR did not come to me while I was amidst the CC - it came afterwards, once I was knee deep in PTs and BRs, because once you're taking 1-2 PTs a week, you'll find the patterns.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Apr 22 2019

Excellent! Just stay on your grind and those PTs will keep going up. :)

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Apr 22 2019

Who is pressuring you?

It depends on what their concerns are and what their intentions are -- maybe they're concerned with you burning yourself out or are worried that you might be putting off the test indefinitely because of test anxiety that you need to address.

Or, it could be that they just don't understand the LSAT. I have very well-meaning friends who thought the LSAT was the same thing as the bar exam, or they think it's something you either pass or fail. If that's the case, then just explain that the LSAT is a very challenging, though learnable, test and you need adequate time to prepare to get the score you really want. Everyone who takes the LSAT has a different timeline because everyone has different desires. If you want to go to a law school that has a median LSAT of 160 and you took a diagnostic and received a 154, you probably won't need to study for as long as someone who had a diagnostic of 140 and is aiming for a 170. So it's all super variable and I'd try to explain this to them.

If they're rushing you because they don't like how much time you spend studying and would rather you spend that time with them hanging out, then just say that this test is very important to your future and you'd like to have their support throughout the process, and if they're not happy with that response, then tell them to go kick rocks.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Saturday, Apr 20 2019

I would discourage you from setting a date before you see the amount of work that lies ahead of you - a jump from a 168 to a 173 might entail a month of shoring up weak points or it might require a more fundamental refinement of your understanding of logic which may take longer.

There isn't really such thing as "too early" when it comes to the LSAT. September is perfectly suitable for any timeline. You can still send in applications early with a Sept. exam. Nov./Dec. is also not too late.

Also, since the March test is undisclosed it's difficult to see what points you missed. Do you have a sense of what was the hardest section? That would be a good indicator of where you should focus your time and energy primarily.

User Avatar

Saturday, Apr 20 2019

sarahmaureenbazir175

Question regarding medians (numbers confuse me.)

I was talking to an LSAT tutor on instagram and they told me that there is no meaningful difference between having an LSAT between the 25th and 50th percentile and having an LSAT that is at or below the 25th. In their opinion, the only thing that matters is that you have an LSAT that is at or above median.

To me, that doesn't seem to make sense mathematically. But, also, I am bad at math, so very little makes sense to me mathematically.

Lets say there's a law school with this LSAT breakdown.

25th percentile: 160

50th percentile: 165

75th percentile: 167

In the view of the tutor, there is no difference between a 164 and a 160 because both are below median -- but is that really the case?

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Saturday, Apr 20 2019

Right now, focus on getting closer to your goal score. There really isn't any way to know for sure how long a 15 point jump might take you. Some ideas are easier (and faster) to grasp than others. Don't impose artificial deadlines/timelines on yourself. Once you are nearing the deadline for September, see where your PT scores are at, and if you're at or around your goal, then register, if not, keep studying.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Saturday, Apr 20 2019

I kinda like seeing the same topics repeated. Even if the question stem is different, the familiarity makes me more confident in answering it.

User Avatar

Friday, Apr 19 2019

sarahmaureenbazir175

Worth retaking a 169?

I just got my March score and received a 169. I'm definitely happy with my score - I've studied for this dang thing for over a year but I'm considering maybe... possibly... retaking.

This is my situation. I have a 4.0 GPA - graduated about a year and a half ago. I'm interested in T14 schools - particularly lower T14 schools with a scholarship. I also had some other tier one schools in mind - like Boston University and UT Austin.

The thing with a 169 is that just a point or two more would put me at or above median at a lot of the T14. The night before the exam, I had a massive panic attack and did not sleep. Literally went into the exam on 0 hours of sleep, convinced I was gonna bomb it. I had been receiving PT scores in the lower170s in the months leading up to the test, so I think maybe I underperformed or lack of sleep contributed to the drop. Or the drop was just a natural test day drop, who knows.

But, I also just don't want to keep studying for this test. I know that sounds lazy and lame, but I've studied for 16 months, 3-4 hours a day, 5 days a week, with virtually no breaks. I'm emotionally drained. But I could muster up the energy if retaking was worthwhile - I don't know definitively that I'll do better and I don't want to go through the process if I'm gonna end up with the same or a lower score. But I also don't want to pass up the chance to retake and live with myself knowing that I might've gotten a scholarship or gotten accepted to a better school had I just put in a couple more months of preparation.

Thoughts?

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Oct 08 2018

It may be a stamina issue or having to quickly switch gears between sections. The more PTs you do, the better you'll get. You have the skills, you just need to get into the right groove.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Oct 08 2018

I used 7Sage in tandem with PowerScore Bibles. I actually read through all of the Bibles before starting 7Sage and I felt like it gave me a good foundational understanding of some concepts in logic.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Oct 08 2018

I definitely think you can make a solid improvement before November but in order to prepare most effectively, you need to ask yourself the following questions about your experience during the September exam:

Did you run out of time on any (or all) sections? Did you feel as though you were rushing towards the end and had to make random or semi-random guesses? If so, timing might be what you want to focus on. If you understand the logic but feel as though you need an extra minute or two on more difficult questions, I recommend doing a lot of timed drills and sections.

Were there certain types of questions you felt you had to go back to or were completely stuck on? Questions where you bounced between two answer choices but couldn't figure out which was wrong and which was correct? If so, that might be an issue with understanding a particular concept. Isolate that concept and study it. Maybe return to the 7Sage Core lesson on it, followed by problem sets.

Did test day make you a lot more anxious than you usually are during a PT? Did you feel "off"? While sometimes test anxiety can't be overcome completely, you can definitely improve the nervousness by taking PTs under rigid testing conditions - that way, when the real deal rolls around in November, it'll only feel (somewhat) like another ole' PT.

Best of luck! I'm hoping to make a jump this November too, so I'm right there with ya. :)

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Saturday, Oct 06 2018

Drill LR by type. There are books - like the PowerScore LR type training book - which take all of the LR questions from an old subset of PTs and categorize them according to "type." If you find yourself struggling on a certain type - drill those questions until you can comfortably answer a wide array of them with little, if any, errors.

AN: I only have 7Sage Starter so I don't have access to things like the question bank - I'm sure the question bank could accomplish the above. But the main advice holds - drill by type.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Saturday, Oct 06 2018

Using a stopwatch instead of a timer is a good start; for some reason I think seeing the clock approaching 35:00 is less stressful than seeing it approach 0.

Perhaps you should try doing specific problem sets timed, rather than entire PT sections. Instead of trying to tackle an entire LR section in 35 minutes, maybe try to tackle the first 10 questions in 10 minutes. You could try doing individual games or individual RC passages in under 9 minutes as well. Once you get comfortable with timing the smaller parts, you can work your way up to entire sections and eventually entire timed PTs.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Friday, Oct 05 2018

I wouldn't say that ranking matters so much as employment does; rankings are just an easy way to estimate roughly how well a school can employ its graduates. However - the actual employment #s and %s, what region(s) or markets graduates end up working in, and the nature of that work (large firm, PI, small firm, solo, etc.) matter a lot.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Monday, Nov 05 2018

I found that my performance improved immensely once I started consciously pausing between paragraphs (and sometimes in the middle of a paragraph) so I can sit and absorb what I just read. I also try to anticipate what the next paragraph will say - not because I'm good at predicting it (I'm actually not) but it forces my brain to think about the material in a more rigorous way.

Your main goal should be comprehension rather than rote memory. When I really understand a passage, I can breeze through passages. For passages with more foreign subject material, I remind myself that I only need to understand exactly what the passage is describing - I don't need any background info.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Friday, Oct 05 2018

Not to beat a dead horse but it really is imperative that you responsibly prepare for the LSAT. It is difficult to overstate how important the LSAT is in shaping the course of the rest of your life. Your LSAT score can mean the difference between massive debt and minimal debt, gainful employment and un(der)employment, as well as a whole list of other very important things which impact your quality of life.

The fact of the matter is that most people, bar those individuals who can finesse a 165+ diagnostic, need a lot longer than 6 weeks to get the sort of score one should have when applying to law school. Sure, you can make some pretty big jumps early on when starting out in the 130s, but to consistently score in the 150s requires a level of foundational understanding that is difficult to cobble together in a month and a half.

You don't have to apply this cycle -- and the fact that you insist that you must apply now makes me question why you began preparing for the exam so recently.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Friday, Oct 05 2018

Just as an update - I took a full PT (5 sections, timed -- I only took 4 section PTs before the September test) and then I blind reviewed.

PT: 171

Blind Review: 180

I got -6 on LG which is typical because I have a timing issue when I reach the fourth game. I know to work on LG.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Thursday, Oct 04 2018

I attended the LSAC forum last year and the year previously even though I knew that this year would be the earliest cycle I'd apply to -- I definitely think it's worth it to go. They're pretty interesting, the panels provide some useful info, and it's nice to hear about different programs at various law schools (scholarship programs, resources for URM/first gen students, etc.) Also, the forums are great if you're a big fan of glossy brochures.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that you'll learn anything groundbreaking but at the very least, I find the forums very motivating and energizing. I remember one panel in particular where attorneys discussed their day-to-day lives in their respective careers ranging from a corporate attorney at a large firm to a municipal judge to a solo practitioner. Very valuable insight.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Wednesday, Oct 03 2018

@oshun1 Thanks so much for the advice! I think my last two PTs were late 70s/80s. All of my previous PTs were in the 50s. I think it was the Sept 2017 PT that I got a 170 on. I'm planning on taking a very recent test (possibly one administered in 2017/2018) as a new diagnostic tomorrow. I'll see where I stand and try to identify weaknesses.

I'm not adamant about applying this cycle. It would be nice to be able to apply this cycle but I value sending in the strongest application possible rather than starting law school by a certain date.

User Avatar

Wednesday, Oct 03 2018

sarahmaureenbazir175

Should I retake in November? Weird situation.

Hi all.

I graduated college last December and basically committed myself to studying for the LSAT since January of 2018. I worked a very flexible part-time job that allowed me to study more or less 15-20 hours a week. My original intention was to take the LSAT in June.

However, in hindsight, my studying was pretty ineffective. I went through the Bibles and took very detailed notes and then registered for 7sage in March (also taking very detailed notes on the lessons.) I kind of ignored practice tests or even practice sections. I guess a good analogy would be that I was reading books on how to play the piano without ever practicing on a piano.

I pushed my test to September and tried taking a practice test every week or so beginning in late July. By the time I had taken the test, I had maybe 7 or 8 PTs completed. Unfortunately, I didn't blind review them like I know I should've and I also didn't spend enough time on logic games (always my worst section.) My scores were in the mid 160s with a one time high of 170.

I sat for the September test and ended up with a 162. My diagnostic back in January was 153. I know I have the potential to do a lot better. My goal is a 170. I have a 4.0 GPA and I'd love to go to a T-14 or a T1 school on a large scholarship (I'm very debt averse.)

I left my job and will be committing myself to just taking PTs, timed sections, blind reviewing, and fool proofing from now until November. Is it possible to see an 8 point improvement by the November test? I hope to take 3 PTs a week between now and the exam.

Some other miscellaneous information:

On PTs, my best section has always been LR. I usually got 1-3 wrong on each LR section. For the September exam, I got -15 (9 and 6) on LR - my worst section. Ironically, I did pretty well on LG - only 2 wrong, despite usually going -5 on LG during PTs.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Tuesday, Oct 02 2018

I usually do very well on LR - normally only get anywhere from 1 to 3 wrong on any given section; test day? -9 and -6. I BOMBED.

I was anticipating a 165+ - ended up with a 162. Disappointed but not terribly so. Retaking in Nov.

Admittedly, I didn't prepare the way I knew I should've. I should've taken far more PTs than I did and I never really committed myself to blind review or fool proofing. For my retake in Nov, I'm gonna double down and make sure I don't repeat those same mistakes.

User Avatar
sarahmaureenbazir175
Tuesday, May 01 2018

@ Thank you for sharing your experience, I greatly appreciate it. I am worried about getting into a weird rut where I just continuously postpone the test (and drain my bank account in the process lol). I may just cancel the June test and then register for the next test whenever I feel comfortable.

I am not opposed to delaying my cycle by a year. I am not in a rush to apply to law school since I just graduated from college a few months ago and I am interested in possibly getting some work experience as a paralegal.

User Avatar

Tuesday, May 01 2018

sarahmaureenbazir175

Postponing June to September. Advice?

Hello all.

Sorry if my writing is erratic, I'm a little stressed.

I am currently studying for the LSAT. I began my preparation in January and have been studying roughly 15-20 hours a week. My diagnostic score was a 153. I read through and took extensive notes on the PowerScore Bible trilogy (filled up a three subject notebook cover to cover with hand-written notes.) When the first of April rolled around, I took my first PT and received a 160. My individual sections were strong during the first half of the test and then dropped significantly after the third section break which seems to indicate an issue of endurance. My goal score is 170+.

I "wasted" April in the sense that I didn't study for a couple of weeks -- due to a family emergency I was traveling extensively and just generally pretty stressed. I deeply regret it because I feel like I'm now a month behind where I wanted to be. I haven't taken another PT and I don't feel like I've made any marked improvements since March. Back in March, I registered for the June test thinking that I'd be well prepared by then -- but now, it feels like its coming up way too quickly. I'm really kicking myself because of it and it fills me with a surprising amount of dread...

I signed up for the 7sage course recently because I didn't think the Bibles alone were adequate. I've found the course to be super helpful so far - I wish I had signed up back in January! But now, it seems as though I won't be done with the core curriculum until well into May and that won't leave me enough time to do the number of PTs I was hoping to tackle before the test.

It seems to me that the obvious solution would be to postpone until September but I am beginning a very stressful full-time job in late June and I don't know if I'll be able to juggle LSAT prep as effectively as I am now (I have a very flexible, low-stress part-time job at the moment.) The June administration was also ideal because I was hoping to assemble my application materials in the summer and send them off to law schools as soon as the app window opens in mid-September.

I was also thinking of just canceling the date and signing up for whatever administration I feel ready for (July, September, etc.) -- I'd lose 80 dollars this way but it'd be worth if for the peace of mind.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!

Confirm action

Are you sure?