@ilikephilosophy993 said:

@xjewelrussell129 said:

@cal270356 @leahbeuk911 @ilikephilosophy993

So since I’m not as done with the LSAT as I swore I was, especially after that brutal Feb release waiting trauma, I have a question. This may not be the best place to ask ? .... buttttt should I do a course? If so ... ? which one?

So far I’ve only self studied.I read & watched explanations for super challenging questions I’d get wrong. For RC/LR - Manhattan forums & LG free YouTube 7Sage videos.

I PT between 173-180 Last 10 PTs.

Part of me feels like for this last whack I’m taking at the LSAT, maybe a course will push my score up a few points? fill in some blanks from a different POV? If so? What course???

Other part of me feels like I’ve come this far alone, I should investigate more were I’m weakest and drill, strengthen & study on my own because - do I have time to UNLEARN and relearn? Would that potentially hurt my score if I’m too busy during the actual test trying to sort through my method + new methods???

We should talk sometime, though! I may be able to help.

Can we? Soon? Please? Message me, please. Thanks!

@cal270356 said:

@xjewelrussell129 said:

@cal270356 @leahbeuk911 @ilikephilosophy993

So since I’m not as done with the LSAT as I swore I was, especially after that brutal Feb release waiting trauma, I have a question. This may not be the best place to ask ? .... buttttt should I do a course? If so ... ? which one?

So far I’ve only self studied.I read & watched explanations for super challenging questions I’d get wrong. For RC/LR - Manhattan forums & LG free YouTube 7Sage videos.

I PT between 173-180 Last 10 PTs.

Part of me feels like for this last whack I’m taking at the LSAT, maybe a course will push my score up a few points? fill in some blanks from a different POV? If so? What course???

Other part of me feels like I’ve come this far alone, I should investigate more were I’m weakest and drill, strengthen & study on my own because - do I have time to UNLEARN and relearn? Would that potentially hurt my score if I’m too busy during the actual test trying to sort through my method + new methods???

What area exactly are you weakest? If it's logic games you might not need the course.

I retook a 172 studied for without 7 sage largely by first doing the core curriculum, then using the 7sage foolproofing method and free logic games explanations to perfect that section, and finally by just by blind reviewing lots of practice tests. I wouldn't change a thing since I wound up with a 180. However, the least important part of those three steps for me was the core curriculum from the starter course. It didn't confuse me, but it bored me at times.

So I would say a course won't hurt, but you might not need it(especially if you happen to have some room for improvement on games).

Make sure you are blind reviewing since if you are not you are missing out on a lot of opportunity to improve each practice test.

https://classic.7sage.com/the-blind-review-how-to-correctly-prep-for-lsat-part-1/

Additionally, if you are not consistantly -1 or -0 on logic games I highly recommend foolproofing tests 1-35 worth of logic games.

https://classic.7sage.com/how-to-get-a-perfect-score-on-the-logic-games/

After a while you can start using this abbreviated foolproofing method.

https://classic.7sage.com/discussion/#/discussion/2737/logic-games-attack-strategy/p1

i am very inconsistent in where i lose points. it usually an even spread, or on my 177-178 PRs it will be all points lost in a completely different section from test to test. those 1-2 super tough Qs per section always get me.

yes, a consistent -0 / -1 on LG. but the occasional -2........... super careless mistakes.

RC always feels terrible & i am never very confident on about 10 LR questions.

i have never blind reviewed or foolproofed in my life. so maybe no prep course immediately. i will learn how to foolproof & blind review & see how that goes for a month. i still have about 20 [old] untouched PTs to play with.

you guys are the best.

confreakingrats on the1freaking80.

where did you end up? what year law student are you? how is it? how did you feel walking out of the test center of your 180? did you know?

@leahbeuk911 said:

@xjewelrussell129 said:

@cal270356 @leahbeuk911 @ilikephilosophy993

So since I’m not as done with the LSAT as I swore I was, especially after that brutal Feb release waiting trauma, I have a question. This may not be the best place to ask ? .... buttttt should I do a course? If so ... ? which one?

So far I’ve only self studied.I read & watched explanations for super challenging questions I’d get wrong. For RC/LR - Manhattan forums & LG free YouTube 7Sage videos.

I PT between 173-180 Last 10 PTs.

Part of me feels like for this last whack I’m taking at the LSAT, maybe a course will push my score up a few points? fill in some blanks from a different POV? If so? What course???

Other part of me feels like I’ve come this far alone, I should investigate more were I’m weakest and drill, strengthen & study on my own because - do I have time to UNLEARN and relearn? Would that potentially hurt my score if I’m too busy during the actual test trying to sort through my method + new methods???

...the 7sage Starter course is pretty much the cheapest course you'll find, but it's so so good.

thanks! i thought I’d have to gun for the ultimate!

I’ll keep you guys posted, as per usual.

@cal270356 @leahbeuk911 @ilikephilosophy993

So since I’m not as done with the LSAT as I swore I was, especially after that brutal Feb release waiting trauma, I have a question. This may not be the best place to ask ? .... buttttt should I do a course? If so ... ? which one?

So far I’ve only self studied.I read & watched explanations for super challenging questions I’d get wrong. For RC/LR - Manhattan forums & LG free YouTube 7Sage videos.

I PT between 173-180 Last 10 PTs.

Part of me feels like for this last whack I’m taking at the LSAT, maybe a course will push my score up a few points? fill in some blanks from a different POV? If so? What course???

Other part of me feels like I’ve come this far alone, I should investigate more were I’m weakest and drill, strengthen & study on my own because - do I have time to UNLEARN and relearn? Would that potentially hurt my score if I’m too busy during the actual test trying to sort through my method + new methods???

@adipick708 said:

I know you said you're aiming for Harvard and not Yale specifically, but this article on Yale's admission blog may convince you that an academic LOR may be a necessity rather than just a strong suggestion:

https://law.yale.edu/admissions/jd-admissions/ask-asha/bad-idea-jeans-biggest-mistake-you-can-make-your-yale-law-school-application

Hope this helps!!! :smile:

I actually don’t necessarily prefer Harvard to Yale. Maybe I do? Yale just seemed a little more unrealistic, but I’m definitly going to aim & prep for Yale - 250 & all. If I got into both I don’t know which I’d pick. So thanks for this! I wouldn’t have known the importance without the article!

Ok. Yea.

So. I’ll get my application airtight.

I am retaking in June. I am applying next cycle regardless of a better/worse June score. I am kinda connected with professors sorta ....? I’ll have to reach out to try and get an academic LOR.

@cal270356 said:

Glad you find it helpful. So if you’re only applying next year, here’s the thing...getting your LSAT higher will be more helpful than trying to build your softs. Your GPA is locked in, but your LSAT isn’t. It’s still up in the air. I know that’s probably not what you want to hear, but it’s the truth. So if you’re deciding between committing X hrs/wk to community service or X hours/wk to studying for the June LSAT, STUDY! And then work on your softs. A 172+ will essentially make you—I think—a VERY likely in at Harvard. Those points—even just 2–will be more effective than extra community service, elementary proficiency in a new language, or new coding skills (after all, you can’t become a Rhodes scholar or Olympian overnight).

Also, be sure to apply early. That’ll help a lot

@ilikephilosophy993

sigh

the truth has been spoken. twice. honestly

seeing the score in the 170s was equal parts amazing & equal parts “man. I can do a couple points better than that.” I managed to shove the retake idea out of my head. But the feeling that i need to keeps popping up....

i do NOT not NOT want to retake but yea... a couple points would change things....

@roystanator440 said:

I think it is honorable that you are shooting for a high score and that you set youe goals high by looking at Harvard. I would say that it would be more productive to focus all your efforts on achieving the 170 and come to us once you have a score on file. That being said, even without a 170, you could get into HYS. I have an acquintenance who got into stanford with a high 160s score, he was urm as well.

@96990

Yeaaaaa. I already have a 17x. But it is on the super low end of the 170s .... suuuuppppeeerrrrr low.

@ilikephilosophy993 said:

@xjewelrussell129 said:

@ilikephilosophy993 said:

To phrase it politely, they probably don't know what they're talking about when it comes to law school admissions. That or they are trying to be nice. I'm not sure which I would say is more likely, tbh.

No one is 100% at YHS, realistically. But if you're looking for an example of a 'lock,' then it's a high LSAT/GPA legacy or first-generation/low-income [URM] with a compelling story that is somehow directly related to the law. Of course there are the 'generic' top-tier softs like Rhodes Scholar, prestigious position in the military, etc., but something depressing and uplifting like overcoming traumatic childhood circumstances or some other such thing probably means more. If you have been able to establish your dedication/commitment to the law in some other way, I would imagine that would go a long way too. Unique work experience is good. Diversity is hugely important to these top schools.

The problem is, most of us can't simply up and decide to secure a killer soft, 'generic' or otherwise. Most of these things take hard work, a hard-to-come-by degree of foresight, and almost always at least a little bit, but most likely lots, of luck. We can't necessarily choose to be diverse in ways that are important to law schools.

Once you have your GPA and LSAT, the most you can contribute to your application is a few effective essays. What makes an "effective essay" is a whole other post, though.

Thank you! THANK YOU. So much of this is so useful as I look back at my life and try to pen these personal and diversity statements.

So. What are your thoughts on the “chance” for a 170/3.5/AA-URM?

I think your chances are pretty good, which is to say how good they are will depend mostly on how well your essays turn out/are received. [There are other considerations like LORs but I assume yours are pretty good?]

So, you have not applied yet? Next cycle, then? I can take a look at your essays if you want.

My LORs are great!!

BUT none are from an academic professor, so I may need to possibly look into a 3rd LOR - as long as it’s also strong - from a prof? If that makes a true difference.

I am applying next cycle & am aiming to apply Day 1 of the cycle To at least have the time benefit in my favor. I have already started working on my essays. Right now just jotting down thoughts of the direction I even want to go in. Thank you a million times: I WILL take you up on your offer if it still stands in the next few weeks when I have some semblance of coherency in a very rough draft.

@cal270356 said:

I don’t think you’re an absolute auto-admit, but a 170 as a URM is really solid for HLS. As you stated, the sample size on LSN is small and there are a whole host of reasons why URM folks might not get into HLS despite numbers like yours; maybe those applicants had iffy LORs, applied really late, weaker personal statement, etc. Those things are always a possibility, for URMs and other folks as well.

As for softs, it’s really hard to say bc the most impressive softs for a place like Harvard aren’t things you can achieve overnight or even in a matter of months: very prestigious scholarships/fellowships (Rhodes), Olympic-level athlete, etc. More “normal” but still impressive softs to a place like Harvard: grad degree from top tier school (think master’s in engineering from MIT or PhD in humanities from Harvard/Princeton/Stanford), work experience at a very prestigious, selective employer (Mckinsey, BCG, etc), and the like. I’ve heard Harvard and Yale have a real TFA soft spot, too.

So what can you do? Make the most of your free time. Try to learn a new language or build proficiency in one you’re already learning. Volunteer more. Develop your tech skills. Pick up hobbies that you enjoy and can talk about in a personal statement or interview in an intelligent manner. This could be virtually anything—you just want it to be memorable: glass blowing, novel writing, jazz dance, whatever.

If you’re applying next cycle, REALLY perfect your personal statement. Get feedback from multiple people, and try to put together a compelling diversity statement. Make sure your LORs are amazing. Getting those bits perfect will be more powerful than trying to build up your “softs” in the next few months

I wasn’t sure that posting here would be too helpful .. you know ... another semi “what are my chances” post.

This is invaluable. Thank you so much.

I have very goodish softs that span several years, but didnt even think to attempt to boost them between now and next cycle. I will def do a little something in the summer. Something I never considered but would def tie together my past years worth of softs with a transition to law school and my legal passion. Thank you!!

@ilikephilosophy993 said:

To phrase it politely, they probably don't know what they're talking about when it comes to law school admissions. That or they are trying to be nice. I'm not sure which I would say is more likely, tbh.

No one is 100% at YHS, realistically. But if you're looking for an example of a 'lock,' then it's a high LSAT/GPA legacy or first-generation/low-income [URM] with a compelling story that is somehow directly related to the law. Of course there are the 'generic' top-tier softs like Rhodes Scholar, prestigious position in the military, etc., but something depressing and uplifting like overcoming traumatic childhood circumstances or some other such thing probably means more. If you have been able to establish your dedication/commitment to the law in some other way, I would imagine that would go a long way too. Unique work experience is good. Diversity is hugely important to these top schools.

The problem is, most of us can't simply up and decide to secure a killer soft, 'generic' or otherwise. Most of these things take hard work, a hard-to-come-by degree of foresight, and almost always at least a little bit, but most likely lots, of luck. We can't necessarily choose to be diverse in ways that are important to law schools.

Once you have your GPA and LSAT, the most you can contribute to your application is a few effective essays. What makes an "effective essay" is a whole other post, though.

Thank you! THANK YOU. So much of this is so useful as I look back at my life and try to pen these personal and diversity statements.

So. What are your thoughts on the “chance” for a 170/3.5/AA-URM?

@tylerdschreur10199 said:

@saimukkamala435 said:

@tylerdschreur10199 said:

@saimukkamala435 said:

@hmccabe1214765 said:

Wait, we won't know the curve?

To my knowledge, no, never. Unless it is one of those undisclosed tests they put in an LSAC prep test then I think we'd still have to figure out if which administration year it was. Like the Superprep has an undisclosed test in it. I think. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

If someone who scores 170 shares how many they got wrong, then there's your curve...

But they wouldn't know how many they got wrong, would they?

I've never taken an undisclosed test, but don't you still get a section breakdown and total number of missed questions? So you would know you got 12 wrong per say?

Nope. The disclose nothing about any of that. Just your score & writing sample.

I got a 17X!!!!!!!!!

OMGGGGG GUYSSSSSS

I GOT A 17X!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

@saimukkamala435 said:

@xjewelrussell129 said:

Am I the only one who hasn’t gotten a score yet??

Story of my life:

More anxiety than the average

Longer time being in anxiety inducing situations than the average.

I can’t be the only one still waiting?

Say it ain’t so....

Who else??

I think you'll get it by midnight. Hang in there. Did you take on 2/10? I got mine suuuuuper fast. It got here before my wine delivery came.

I DID take it on 2/10, but I got the Sabbath version, so it was kinda a hot mess. Maybe that’s why.....

Am I the only one who hasn’t gotten a score yet??

Story of my life:

More anxiety than the average

Longer time being in anxiety inducing situations than the average.

I can’t be the only one still waiting?

Say it ain’t so....

Who else??

@paulwpederson403 said:

I got my score and wow I did not do well at all! Yay.

I am SO sorry to hear that. Was it way worse than you expected?

June! No worries ❤️

@berthstefan671 said:

same :(

@ianrobertparkins157 said:

Still nothing and I'm fading fast :(

Same. Stressed.

@nicoleryoung895 said:

anyone else's item response report blank?

Item response will be blank because it’s undisclosed. That means no item response, no image of test booklet. Can’t see the curve. Won’t know what questions you got wrong etc.

I think it’s essentially just the sheet that shows your score & your writing sample. Nothing else.

My LSAC is giving me an error when I try to log in. I would assume all the users are causing it to crash - but everyone sees their grey icons.

What gives?

I cannot imagine being asleep now & waking up and casually checking email only to see LSAC SCORE in the subject line.

Maybe that’s better than this nailbiting down to the minute wait??

@saimukkamala435 said:

@ianrobertparkins157 said:

@saimukkamala435 said:

OMG I GOT MY SCORE

ARE YOU HAPPY WITH IT????

YES I cannot believe it. I made an 11 point increase by studying w/7sage, I studied for 10 weeks total. I am freaking out here.

CONGRATS!!!!!!!

ok. i’m drunk. it’s cool.