Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

A Weekend of Waitlists

Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
edited February 2018 in Law School Admissions 3521 karma

Hey all,

Seems like a lot of waitlists are being sent out today. I just got waitlisted at both UMich and Columbia. My numbers make me pretty competitive for both schools so I'm kind of wondering - what gives?

In both e-mails they seem to be stressing the huge number of qualified applicants this cycle, but I'm wondering if they say that every cycle. Then again, some of us saw the data from earlier this year that the number of 170+ scorer applicants increased dramatically this cycle. I'm also wondering if it's because I applied to some of these schools sort of late in the cycle, and I would have been admitted had I sent my application earlier.

Any thoughts? Concerns? Anyone else getting waitlisted this weekend???

Best,

Paul

Comments

  • Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
    3521 karma

    FYI - for those of you thinking about writing Letters of Continued Interest, remember 7Sage has some videos on that :smile: https://7sage.com/admissions/lesson/loci-basics/

  • Sarah889Sarah889 Alum Member
    877 karma

    I got waitlisted at UPenn and Columbia this week. I feel you. Luckily, neither school were in my top picks but it always sucks to get that WL email... It's better than a rejection though! Best of luck.

  • Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
    3521 karma

    @Sarah889 Lawschoolnumbers' ticker is showing a lot of people getting waitlisted at UPenn today. I have my fingers crossed I don't hear from them in the next few hours!

    That's good though that they weren't your top pics :smile:

  • acsimonacsimon Alum Member
    1264 karma

    Wow, that doesn’t bode well for me. I’ve applied super late in the cycle and just hope that I get at least a couple of hits rather than WLs so I can at least rest somewhat easy.

    I would’ve thought u’d be automatic at those schools (and at least one). Stay positive, however. Bet there’s an awesome opportunity coming down the pipe!—A.c.S

  • goingfor99thgoingfor99th Member
    edited February 2018 3072 karma

    Waitlisted at Columbia last week, waitlisted at Michigan and Penn today.

  • tylerdschreur10tylerdschreur10 Alum Member
    1465 karma

    Duke last week, Penn on Friday :| I applied in Late December, so not super late, but maybe late enough due to this tough cycle.

  • tylerdschreur10tylerdschreur10 Alum Member
    1465 karma

    Also, I got an email from NYU saying that my "application remains under review" and then the usual holistic approach, careful consideration spiel. Is this a waitlist? Or just a pointless email to get my heart racing?

  • mcglz_64mcglz_64 Alum Member
    891 karma

    @tylerdschreur10 said:
    Also, I got an email from NYU saying that my "application remains under review" and then the usual holistic approach, careful consideration spiel. Is this a waitlist? Or just a pointless email to get my heart racing?

    Still being reviewed-not a waitlist

  • lsatplaylistlsatplaylist Alum Member
    5244 karma

    Yes, they're not finished with it yet, probably. Despite the heart racing, it might be a good sign that you have to wait a bit longer.

  • calcal101calcal101 Alum Member
    582 karma

    Hi @"Paul Caint"! Remember…waitlists aren't rejections. Did you write a Why Mich or another one of their optional topics?

  • Stevie CStevie C Alum Member
    edited February 2018 645 karma

    What are your numbers? Columbia was 171/3.7 last year but now there are more applicants, so medians might be 3.7/172 or 3.8/171 this cyle

  • OlamHafuchOlamHafuch Alum Member
    2326 karma

    Certainly, if schools were sending out acceptances at the same rate as in previous years, then they would have reached the number of acceptances they need to yield their desired class size sooner in the cycle. Michigan and Penn are not going to change their class sizes just because there are more applicants, so it is possible that applicants who submitted later in the cycle are at more of a disadvantage this year.

  • Nick GonzalezNick Gonzalez Alum Member
    19 karma

    I have also been hit by the wait-list wave. I got wait-listed at Columbia, Georgetown, and UCLA all this week. I applied mid-December so it might be the large amount of applications.

  • westcoastbestcoastwestcoastbestcoast Alum Member
    3788 karma

    @uhinberg said:
    Certainly, if schools were sending out acceptances at the same rate as in previous years, then they would have reached the number of acceptances they need to yield their desired class size sooner in the cycle. Michigan and Penn are not going to change their class sizes just because there are more applicants, so it is possible that applicants who submitted later in the cycle are at more of a disadvantage this year.

    Did you talk to admission officers about this? Some admission officers said they would increase class sizes. Spivey also spoke of the possibility that this would happen as well

  • Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
    3521 karma

    @acsimon said:
    Wow, that doesn’t bode well for me. I’ve applied super late in the cycle and just hope that I get at least a couple of hits rather than WLs so I can at least rest somewhat easy.

    I would’ve thought u’d be automatic at those schools (and at least one). Stay positive, however. Bet there’s an awesome opportunity coming down the pipe!—A.c.S

    I'm hoping so! Idk though, it really does seem like late applicants are being especially penalized this cycle due to the influx of high quality applicants. I've heard of a few 4.0+/170+'s being waitlisted at Michigan also :neutral:.

    @goingfor99th said:
    Waitlisted at Columbia last week, waitlisted at Michigan and Penn today.

    Dang, isn't that crazy lol. In at Yale, waitlisted at Michigan, Penn, and Columbia. Shows you that each school really has it's own way of admitting kids, and higher numbers does not necessarily mean higher ranked schools!

  • Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
    3521 karma

    @calcal101 said:
    Hi @"Paul Caint"! Remember…waitlists aren't rejections. Did you write a Why Mich or another one of their optional topics?

    No I didn't, my apps were already kinda late so I just sent them out as fast as I could. To be honest, I don't think Michigan even read my file; I think they just ran outta spots and started waitlsiting people, which is kinda annoying because I think I have pretty strong softs.

    @uhinberg said:
    Certainly, if schools were sending out acceptances at the same rate as in previous years, then they would have reached the number of acceptances they need to yield their desired class size sooner in the cycle. Michigan and Penn are not going to change their class sizes just because there are more applicants, so it is possible that applicants who submitted later in the cycle are at more of a disadvantage this year.

    That's what I'm thinking.

  • Habeas PorpoiseHabeas Porpoise Alum Member Sage
    edited February 2018 1861 karma

    @"Paul Caint" said:
    In both e-mails they seem to be stressing the huge number of qualified applicants this cycle, but I'm wondering if they say that every cycle.

    Is there a pickup in the number of people applying to law school nowadays? I always used to hear about the downward trend in law school applications.

    Edit: https://www.usnews.com/education/blogs/law-admissions-lowdown/articles/2017-09-04/check-out-predictions-about-2017-2018-law-school-application-trends
    Ah, so apparently there isn't necessarily an increase in the number of applicants, but an increase in the number of schools each applicant is applying to.

  • LCMama2017LCMama2017 Alum Member
    2134 karma
  • Habeas PorpoiseHabeas Porpoise Alum Member Sage
    1861 karma

    Oh wow, yeah, that is an insane increase especially compared to last year. It's probably going to continue to increase moving forward, especially with the unlimited takes. Even more so if more schools begin accepting the GRE.

  • goingfor99thgoingfor99th Member
    edited February 2018 3072 karma

    @"Paul Caint" said:

    Dang, isn't that crazy lol. In at Yale, waitlisted at Michigan, Penn, and Columbia. Shows you that each school really has it's own way of admitting kids, and higher numbers does not necessarily mean higher ranked schools!

    Admittedly, I think the waitlists happened to me for a simpler reason than that. :P

  • LCMama2017LCMama2017 Alum Member
    2134 karma

    @goingfor99th said:

    @"Paul Caint" said:

    Dang, isn't that crazy lol. In at Yale, waitlisted at Michigan, Penn, and Columbia. Shows you that each school really has it's own way of admitting kids, and higher numbers does not necessarily mean higher ranked schools!

    Admittedly, I think the waitlists happened to me for a simpler reason than that. :P

    So - basically Mich, Penn and Columbia knew you'd be applying to higher ranked schools (not that many) and decided to wait list you? I mean, what if you didn't get into Yale? Then they would just be screwing you... and that's just not nice.

  • Michael MaMichael Ma Alum Member
    186 karma

    @"Paul Caint" said:
    No I didn't, my apps were already kinda late so I just sent them out as fast as I could. To be honest, I don't think Michigan even read my file; I think they just ran outta spots and started waitlsiting people, which is kinda annoying because I think I have pretty strong softs.

    I dont mean to be a contrarian, but I highly doubt this is true. I submitted my Michigan app after the new year, and I didn’t write a why x essay either and I was admitted last week. My numbers are by no means an auto admit. I am not a URM, and I fully believe my LORs and PS was what put me over the top. I think it’s easy to be cynical during the heart of the cycle but I don’t find it helpful.
    BTW, I’m not trying to be boisterous. Just trying to keep everyone else who’s still waiting on a decesion spirit up.

  • goingfor99thgoingfor99th Member
    edited February 2018 3072 karma

    @LCMama2017 said:

    @goingfor99th said:

    @"Paul Caint" said:

    Dang, isn't that crazy lol. In at Yale, waitlisted at Michigan, Penn, and Columbia. Shows you that each school really has it's own way of admitting kids, and higher numbers does not necessarily mean higher ranked schools!

    Admittedly, I think the waitlists happened to me for a simpler reason than that. :P

    So - basically Mich, Penn and Columbia knew you'd be applying to higher ranked schools (not that many) and decided to wait list you? I mean, what if you didn't get into Yale? Then they would just be screwing you... and that's just not nice.

    No, no. That's not what I'm saying. lol

  • LCMama2017LCMama2017 Alum Member
    2134 karma

    @goingfor99th said:

    @LCMama2017 said:

    @goingfor99th said:

    @"Paul Caint" said:

    Dang, isn't that crazy lol. In at Yale, waitlisted at Michigan, Penn, and Columbia. Shows you that each school really has it's own way of admitting kids, and higher numbers does not necessarily mean higher ranked schools!

    Admittedly, I think the waitlists happened to me for a simpler reason than that. :P

    So - basically Mich, Penn and Columbia knew you'd be applying to higher ranked schools (not that many) and decided to wait list you? I mean, what if you didn't get into Yale? Then they would just be screwing you... and that's just not nice.

    No, no. That's not what I'm saying. lol

    Oh, ha! Never mind!

  • calcal101calcal101 Alum Member
    edited February 2018 582 karma

    @"Paul Caint" in that case, if you’re serious about Mich, send one now. I submitted with 3.9x and 17x (low) in early Jan and was admitted last week. I think it was largely bc I wrote a Why Mich. I don’t think they’d just waitlist you without reading your app. There are a lot of other components...being k-jd might also hurt some applicants (don’t know if that applies to you)

  • Seeking PerfectionSeeking Perfection Alum Member
    4423 karma

    @"Paul Caint" said:

    @calcal101 said:
    Hi @"Paul Caint"! Remember…waitlists aren't rejections. Did you write a Why Mich or another one of their optional topics?

    No I didn't, my apps were already kinda late so I just sent them out as fast as I could. To be honest, I don't think Michigan even read my file; I think they just ran outta spots and started waitlsiting people, which is kinda annoying because I think I have pretty strong softs.

    @uhinberg said:
    Certainly, if schools were sending out acceptances at the same rate as in previous years, then they would have reached the number of acceptances they need to yield their desired class size sooner in the cycle. Michigan and Penn are not going to change their class sizes just because there are more applicants, so it is possible that applicants who submitted later in the cycle are at more of a disadvantage this year.

    That's what I'm thinking.

    I applied late too because one of my recommenders took until just before the New Year to finish his letter, but with a strong Why Michigan. Historically, Michigan, Penn, and Virginia are among the most likely to waitlist people who don't bother with Why X essays. They just don't trust you to go there if you don't write the essay and know that accepting people who won't come slightly hurts their ranking. If you still want in, I would submit one.

  • Paul CaintPaul Caint Alum Member
    edited February 2018 3521 karma

    Thanks all, that's pretty illuminating stuff. Yeah it felt some might say my numbers would classify me as an "auto-admit," but maybe since I didn't bother writing a Why Michigan essay they yield protected me.

    I'm also thinking back to what an undergraduate admissions officer said once, sometimes you strike a chord with a reader, and sometimes you don't [insert shrug emoji]

    @"Seeking Perfection" How does one go about retroactively sending a "Why Michigan" essay - through a LOCI?

  • Seeking PerfectionSeeking Perfection Alum Member
    edited February 2018 4423 karma

    @"Paul Caint" said:
    Thanks all, that's pretty illuminating stuff. Yeah it felt some might say my numbers would classify me as an "auto-admit," but maybe since I didn't bother writing a Why Michigan essay they yield protected me.

    I'm also thinking back to what an undergraduate admissions officer said once, sometimes you strike a chord with a reader, and sometimes you don't [insert shrug emoji]

    @"Seeking Perfection" How does one go about retroactively sending a "Why Michigan" essay - through a LOCI?

    I did it within my app so I don't know for sure, but if I were you I would write an essay addressing the Why Michigan optional essay prompt. I would then call them and ask how you can add it to your application. I bet they'll ask you to email it to them as an attachment (probably to their admissions department email address).

    I would write something short in the body of the email about your continued interest and how you want to make sure that they knew all the reasons why you want to attend Michigan. I would thank them for their reconsideration and their time.

    I think you get the whole yield protection idea pretty well, but if anyone doesn't U of M is the perfect example.

    Auto admit numbers don't work if they are yield protecting. In fact, they are part of what scares them off. However, that does mean that they sometimes give people not inconsiderable scholarships off the waitlist. They still want you, but just want reassurance the feeling is mutual.

    It shows up pretty well on law school numbers. A really high percentage of people above certain numbers get waitlisted, but most of those with those numbers who get in either right away or later get some sort of scholarship. The scholarships tells us they wanted the people and the waitlists that they were yield protecting.

    http://michigan.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1718
    You can see all the yellow dots here up in the theoretically auto admit area.

    http://michigan.lawschoolnumbers.com/applicants/1617?order=desc&sort=lsat
    If you sort the LSAT scores high to low by clucking on the word LSAT once you are at the link, you can see the scholarship money they gave out to those they did let in here. Some of these people were let in off the wait list.

    It is clearer if you select the year for both links as 2016-2017 so you see a whole cycle's results. However, the same pattern is playing out this year though the scholarships are not all in yet and there are still lots of pending decisions.

Sign In or Register to comment.