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Our Free Logic Game Videos

J.Y. PingJ.Y. Ping Administrator Instructor
edited March 2020 in General 13667 karma

Hi everyone.

I have really bad news.

We are taking down all of our free Logic Game videos on YouTube on November 15.

Two months ago, LSAC's legal department requested that we remove the videos on copyright violation grounds. We immediately retained Quinn Emanuel, one of the best law firms in the country, and worked with two amazing lawyers (one of whom used to be a 7Sager) to try to work this out with LSAC. Despite our efforts, they remain firm. Our remaining option was to litigate but we don't have the resources to pursue that path.

On November 15 our LG videos will no longer be available to the public for free. They will still exist, but only to students enrolled in a full 7Sage course. This way, we can track usage and send licensing fees accordingly.

These videos have been free for nearly eight years. In that time period, we created an alternative to the paradigm of expensive, in-class test prep in the form of free and low cost, on-demand lessons. I'm sad to see these free videos—a mainstay of both our business and social mission—go. I've had many students tell me that they couldn't afford a course but fully utilized our LG videos, which made me very happy. I've also had many tutors tell me that they don't tutor LG anymore because there's no need to. It makes me feel good to know that we made an impact for some students.

I wanted to see in quantitative terms how much of an impact the LG videos made.

We ran the numbers and generated the chart below. This is data pulled from our analytics. We did our best to exclude retakes, older data, and other data that might inflate scores. Look at the blue and grey lines for LR and RC. They peak around minus 3 or 4, meaning more 7Sagers got around 3 to 4 wrong per section than any other number. Compared to the full population of LSAT takers, this curve is likely left-skewed simply because they're all 7Sagers, a group of students who take their studies seriously. Still, the distribution is relatively normal; you can make out the curve. Relatively few people get -0/-1 on those sections.

Now look at the orange line for LG. The peak of the curve sits at -0/-1. Take a second to think about this. This means more 7Sage students taking PTs got an LG score of -0 or -1 than any other score. That's not normal.

https://i.imgur.com/wbGCrjb.png

I'm curious about the actual exam data on the yearly LG curve over the past decade. My guess is that the curve moved left, meaning the average student has been significantly improving on LG. The actual LG curve might even look similar to ours, since everyone had access to our LG videos. If true, this could offer an explanation for LSAC's increasing preference for weird, miscellaneous games.

Anyway, back to the fact that we're having to remove all our LG videos from YouTube, which is really the point of this post: I'm sorry. If I don't sound more upset about it, it's only because I've had two months now to absorb the blow.

You probably have questions. I'll try to check back here today and tomorrow to answer the ones I can.

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Comments

  • 2ndTimestheCharm2ndTimestheCharm Alum Member
    edited November 2019 1805 karma

    I'm so sorry this happened. I came to 7Sage, like many people, through the insightful, funny, calm and easy-to-follow LG videos.

    But there's so much good news here, J.Y. You've boosted the scores, understanding, hearts and minds of hundreds of people, and we are eternally grateful. Also, you'll still be doing it! For as long as you can stand it.

    Even though it's obviously a more admirable social mission to spread your LG wisdom to anyone who wants it, including those who can't afford to pay, the truth is it is a product worth paying for.

    Also, in terms of the business mission, I don't think you'll need the free entry point anymore. I remember taking a mock test in Wilmington, Delaware, and the person sitting next to me expounding the virtues of the 7Sage videos without me mentioning it first. Last weekend at the LSAC Forum in NYC, I was waiting for the debt-handling master dude to have some one-on-one with him, and the random person waiting on line next to me? Total 7Sager. The word has spread. Thank you.

  • noonawoonnoonawoon Alum Member
    3481 karma

    Thank you for doing your best to make LSAT study material free/low cost. I found this course through the free videos which led me to purchase the Ultimate course. Very happy with my choice

  • Shane C.Shane C. Alum Member
    131 karma

    Thank you for letting us know. I am so glad that I heard of 7Sage through your logic videos online, and it is unfortunate to hear that they will have to come down.

    Are you thinking about having the logic game videos available to all students, regardless of what package they have purchased on 7Sage?

  • Sharon_sarangyangSharon_sarangyang Legacy Member
    91 karma

    I just want to say thank you. You've made the task of conquering LG and LSAT in its entirely a way more humane and delightful process ^^

  • a. valdeza. valdez Alum Member
    edited October 2019 112 karma

    LSAC yet again coming up with another way to make the LSAT more inaccessible :neutral: This is incredibly upsetting but thank you nonetheless for all the time and effort you've invested into this program.

  • drbrown2drbrown2 Alum Member
    2227 karma

    Thank you for always being there for all of your students. Is there an option to leave explanations up for PTs that have been released to the public by LSAC? They’ve added a few more for digital familiarization, and if LG for those tests stayed up it could still help students who can’t afford a course package.

  • Anonymouse-1Anonymouse-1 Alum Member
    189 karma

    Who is this guy with 10k Karma?

  • Cookie MoonCookie Moon Member
    edited October 2019 264 karma

    Will you offer alternative way for the LG access? Maybe another package just for all the games or open access to starter package ?

  • LSATSurvivorLSATSurvivor Alum Member
    228 karma

    Thank you for being awesome.

  • Silvia_LSilvia_L Alum Member
    55 karma

    Sorry to hear that. I learned about 7Sage from those free youtube videos, and I am sure it has helped tons of LSAT students. :wink:

  • ChardiggityChardiggity Alum Member
    336 karma

    I'm so sorry to hear this. I was a refugee from a different online LSAT prep company that is frankly a shoddy operation. You had to request an LG video explanation for any particular game not already in their collection before they would bother to make one. I couldn't wait for them to get around to it IF they ever did (another common problem) so I went hunting for help online and found 7sage. The videos were so helpful that I eventually went on to buy Ultimate+ and have been thrilled with it! Thank you for making the videos available for as long as you could. I hope like hell that a 7sage alumni is involved in the litigation against them when LSAC finally gets held accountable for some of their terrible practices.

  • galaxygalgalaxygal Alum Member
    224 karma

    Thank you for doing all that you could do. 7Sage contains the best LSAT prep materials that I've come across and the lengths that your team goes to make these materials accessible to everyone speaks volumes to the integrity of this company. I also discovered 7Sage through the free videos on YouTube, but I would proudly pay for the videos any day.

  • LSATcantwinLSATcantwin Alum Member Sage
    edited October 2019 13286 karma

    Fuck the LSAC. Pretty much all I have to say about that.

    7Sage you're still amazing and I thank you for everything you have done to help people reach their dreams. I would not be where I am now without you and I will NEVER forget it.

  • Leah M BLeah M B Alum Member
    8392 karma

    Ugh, LSAC continually finds ways to make hurdles higher for everyone. This is so pointless and meritless and... ugh. All the things. Thank you so much for how you have advocated for all of us - I also wouldn't be where I am without 7sage (and am so lucky to even have the 7sage community live on in school!). I know that this is a massive disappointment, but the 7sage model will continue to level the playing field and help people with fewer resources thrive in the legal field. <3

  • jenna-e-nelsonjenna-e-nelson Legacy Member
    19 karma

    I'm really sad to hear this. The first time I took the LSAT I self studied using the bibles. After every PT I took I would watch the respective free LG videos. These are what drew me to come to 7sage for my second LSAT next week. My first go around I was scoring around -5 for every LG sections, recently I've been going -0. This is something I never would've achieved if I hadn't found 7sage through the free youtube videos. Thank you for making such an effort to make LSAT studying content accessible.

  • zacharytsmith26zacharytsmith26 Alum Member
    edited October 2019 844 karma

    I got lucky by coming across those videos on youtube. Before 7sage I was hoping that somehow someway I could find a way to get through 3 games in 35 min, not I often finish a section with plenty of time to spare.

  • AudaciousRedAudaciousRed Alum Member
    2689 karma

    Those free videos led me to this program, to this community, and to succeeding. I might not have known about what 7sage had to offer had I not kept hitting those videos every time I got stuck on an LG problem. Those videos were vital.

    I hope lsac reaps every bit of the karma they have sewn. 🤬😡

  • tams2018tams2018 Alum Member
    727 karma

    I figured with LSAT going digital this was going to happen.

  • J.Y. PingJ.Y. Ping Administrator Instructor
    edited October 2019 13667 karma

    @"Shane C." said:
    Thank you for letting us know. I am so glad that I heard of 7Sage through your logic videos online, and it is unfortunate to hear that they will have to come down.

    Are you thinking about having the logic game videos available to all students, regardless of what package they have purchased on 7Sage?

    Obvious Ultimate+ gets everything, but I'm not sure yet about the other course levels. I'll think about this and let you know in a week.

    @kikislsat

  • J.Y. PingJ.Y. Ping Administrator Instructor
    13667 karma

    @drbrown2 said:
    Thank you for always being there for all of your students. Is there an option to leave explanations up for PTs that have been released to the public by LSAC? They’ve added a few more for digital familiarization, and if LG for those tests stayed up it could still help students who can’t afford a course package.

    Would make sense right? But I already asked and no, they won't let us use the PTs they released for free to make freely accessible videos.

  • sundance-1-1sundance-1-1 Monthly Member
    18 karma

    omg i cried at this. truly really crappy news. if i signed up for the cheapest course package would i still be able to have access to LG vids? i can't afford much more than that and LG videos were already a life saver for me :(

  • LogicianLogician Alum Member Sage
    2453 karma

    Such a shame to hear this. Yet another -however incremental- way LSAC has increased the barriers to education. Have you though of offering just an LG course with the explanations? I would imagine you’d be able to sell such a course under or around the $100 price point. That way at least those who are less financially fortunate will have an easier time accessing these great lessons. Regardless, the damage has been dealt. Keep keeping on JY, I’m a huge advocate of what you’re doing.

  • FindingSageFindingSage Alum Member
    2042 karma

    I found 7 Sage through the logic games videos on YouTube. They were so good that I started to think maybe I could find help for LR or RC as well. So I went to your channel and that was when I heard the interview with Josh. His perseverance and story really registered with me and I signed up for 7Sage the same day. I stayed with a lower level account for a while but now have an Ultimate + account and it has honestly opened up a whole new world. I have been working logic games from older tests and it has made me a much better test taker!

    The fact that you are being asked to remove the videos right at the time that the law suit which will modify logic games eventually doesn’t feel coincidental to me. LSAC can make speeches and write emails about accessibility and trying to make the test more fair to everyone to would want to take but this just feels like another slap in the face to people who can’t afford a $1000+ Kaplan course which isn’t going to teach then much anyway.

    Thank you for having made and sometimes remade all these videos and having had them up as long as you can!

  • cldennis94cldennis94 Monthly Member
    145 karma

    I am very glad I found 7Sage in time. The ways in which higher education is becoming inaccessible to those without the financial means to get there is disheartening. Though expensive, 7Sage is still cheaper than many other options. Thanks for doing the best you can.

  • BlindReviewerBlindReviewer Alum Member
    855 karma

    Came back to 7Sage to just post about this -- I was lucky enough to get a good enough score on the July exam, but as I prepared for alternate scenarios of taking the Oct/Nov exams, I was already stressed out because LSAC had basically no test centers near me (or they were all enrolled). And now they've decided to take away resources that have allowed so many to learn about the LSAT before committing to a particular course, which is unbelievably frustrating.

    There's so much about this process that is unbearably stupid and at times pretty outrageous, but without a community like 7Sage there would be little to offset the ills of the system. Regardless of what happens, 7Sage is the best option out there for LSAT studying, and even though LSAC may have raised the bar for accessibility, 7Sage still allows way more people to think about law school. Thank you for everything!

  • smartaone2smartaone2 Monthly Member
    500 karma

    So basically LSAC is saying, there has been too much success on the LG section due to 7Sage's "free" LG videos and therefore, these must be removed to ensure there will not be "as much success" on this section. Is that the understanding? By the way, THANK YOU and everyone else who creates the BEST learning environment one can experience with 7Sage!!

  • Cant Get RightCant Get Right Alum Member Sage 🍌
    edited October 2019 27107 karma

    That future students will be deprived of such a great benefit that I enjoyed and that was so powerfully effective in my studies and ultimately transformative in my life is deeply upsetting to me. LSAC's action may help correct the curve, but it will inevitably be at the expense of those with the least privilege and most restricted access to the means of bettering themselves and their communities. Rungs on the ladder upwards are few and far between as it is, and that a sturdy and reliable one is being removed by the gatekeepers is unconscionable.

  • Lolo1996Lolo1996 Legacy Member
    498 karma

    A new RRE question: LSAC promotes their free study materials on khan academy, and goes on about how they want everyone to have an equal shot at law school, but then takes down the free LG explanations.

    I find it ironic. Regardless, thank you JY, for making LSAT explanations availible to those of us without the money to buy tutors. I know I would not be able to do it without 7sage! Your course is very affordable compared to some of the stuff out there, and it is super helpful for those of us who are auditory learners. I love hearing your explanations! They are really the best.

    An idea: maybe you can offer a package that is only for LG at a lower price? Or maybe a pay-per-access system (like, most recent 10 PT solutions for LG for X$). That way, students can buy access as they wish? Anyways, that is just an idea to make it accessible for a low cost :)

    I just wanted you to know that myself, and others, are very appreciative for everything you've done! :)

  • J.B. JD ASAPJ.B. JD ASAP Legacy Member
    137 karma

    So, since corporations are people, I guess they can get very insecure and jealous as well. Too bad this trend is getting stronger. You’ve helped thousands JY, and for that you should be proud.

  • michaelschaummichaelschaum Legacy Member
    16 karma

    This is sad to hear. I would not have learned of 7sage if it weren't for those free videos. Good thing I'm enrolled :smile:

  • Sim SimmaSim Simma Alum Member
    168 karma

    Hi, I am relatively new to this community. I don't have an account. I basically got told by the dude I bought LSAT prep books from that 7sage is a legit resource. I've been using your LG explanations. I'm taking the LSAT Nov.25th. So I'd have a 10-day period of no access to your LG stuff. I'd be down to look into some kind of package/membership deal/whatever in order to have that access. What would you recommend?

    (It is possible that I re-take the test, in which case I would have use for the package/deal afterwards as well). Please let me know.

  • ReginaSpiewakJonesReginaSpiewakJones Alum Member
    177 karma

    Please come up with a price point option, that includes the LG videos so many depend on, at an affordable price!

  • bosaso321bosaso321 Member
    10 karma

    I really don't know what I'll do without these LG explanations as I really can't afford the Ultimate course package. Will the videos still be available for free on the website? Thank you so much for making them as it has made the LSAT and a career in law seem so much more accessible for low-income students like myself.

  • ericauhunmwanghoericauhunmwangho Monthly Member
    108 karma

    Hi JY this is super upsetting to hear for someone that is still on their LSAT journey like I am your videos are such a huge part of my prep I don't even know what to do. Do you guys think you can make a foolproof logic games package only? For someone like me I have already purchased a nearly $2000 dollar course which didn't help, not from 7 sage but I worked so hard to pay for that and on top of other bills and applying to law school how is someone going to afford the Ultimate package, this is truly the worst thing and Idek how LSAC can honestly do this and not feel disgusting about themselves this is so sad, and smells like greediness for money its so upsetting to hear.

  • VegaHedgingVegaHedging Alum Member
    edited October 2019 111 karma

    F the LSAC

  • marina25ulloamarina25ulloa Alum Member
    9 karma

    Thank you so much for your work! Would absolutely love a LG package deal at an affordable price. :)

  • @bosaso321

    I really don't know what I'll do without these LG explanations as I really can't afford the Ultimate course package. Will the videos still be available for free on the website? Thank you so much for making them as it has made the LSAT and a career in law seem so much more accessible for low-income students like myself.

    Unfortunately, there will no longer be free access to the videos on 7Sage either, but we have decided that students enrolled in our Premium, Ultimate, and Ultimate+ courses will have access to all Logic Games video explanations (currently PT 1- 87). That way, you don't necessarily have to buy U+ in order to access them.

    Let us know if you have any other questions!

  • @"sundus.sheikh825"

    omg i cried at this. truly really crappy news. if i signed up for the cheapest course package would i still be able to have access to LG vids? i can't afford much more than that and LG videos were already a life saver for me :(

    We have decided that students enrolled in our Premium, Ultimate, and Ultimate+ courses will have access to all Logic Games video explanations (currently PT 1- 87).

    If you have a fee waiver from LSAC, you can get Premium with $179 off (we offer either a free Starter course or $179 off of your purchase of Premium, Ultimate, or Ultimate+. Please note with the free Starter course you can't purchase extensions or PrepTests on this page: https://7sage.com/addons/ But you can upgrade to Premium, Ultimate, or Ultimate+ later).

  • motximotximotximotxi Alum Member
    88 karma

    Thanks @J.Y, please let us know! I had not realised this would affect those of us with the starter package :(

    @"J.Y. Ping" said:

    @"Shane C." said:
    Thank you for letting us know. I am so glad that I heard of 7Sage through your logic videos online, and it is unfortunate to hear that they will have to come down.

    Are you thinking about having the logic game videos available to all students, regardless of what package they have purchased on 7Sage?

    Obvious Ultimate+ gets everything, but I'm not sure yet about the other course levels. I'll think about this and let you know in a week.

    @kikislsat

  • ShamsiesShamsies Legacy Member
    5 karma

    This is so sad. I love these videos and watch them all the time. They've helped me improve on games, something that other LSAT prep courses couldn't do for me.

    Will the videos not be available to students enrolled in the LSAT Starter course? I live in Canada so the prices to upgrade to premium are much higher with the exchange rate and something I don't think I can afford...

    Thanks for all the great work you put into 7sage! It's a life saver for sure.

  • smartaone2smartaone2 Monthly Member
    500 karma

    @"Elaine --Student Service--" said:

    Unfortunately, there will no longer be free access to the videos on 7Sage either, but we have decided that students enrolled in our Premium, Ultimate, and Ultimate+ courses will have access to all Logic Games video explanations (currently PT 1- 87). That way, you don't necessarily have to buy U+ in order to access them.

    Let us know if you have any other questions!

    So if you have the Starter course we will no longer have access to the LG videos?

  • J.Y. PingJ.Y. Ping Administrator Instructor
    13667 karma

    @motximotxi @Shamsies @smartaone2

    The Starter course includes all video explanations (including LG) for PTs 36-44, so you'll have those.

    For LG videos from other PTs, they will not be included.

  • smartaone2smartaone2 Monthly Member
    500 karma

    Ok thanks JY!

  • bigjoecbigjoec Alum Member
    56 karma

    @"J.Y. Ping" said:
    @motximotxi @Shamsies @smartaone2

    The Starter course includes all video explanations (including LG) for PTs 36-44, so you'll have those.

    For LG videos from other PTs, they will not be included.

    If I purchase a PT (e.g., PT87), will I have access to the video explanation for the LG on that PT?

  • Juliet --Student Service--Juliet --Student Service-- Member Administrator Student Services
    5277 karma

    @bigjoec said:

    @"J.Y. Ping" said:
    @motximotxi @Shamsies @smartaone2

    The Starter course includes all video explanations (including LG) for PTs 36-44, so you'll have those.

    For LG videos from other PTs, they will not be included.

    If I purchase a PT (e.g., PT87), will I have access to the video explanation for the LG on that PT?

    Hi there,

    Yes, you will have access to all video explanations (including LG), for any PrepTest you have access to in your course (including PrepTests purchased separately).

  • bradshawbmsbradshawbms Legacy Member
    4 karma

    Press F to pay respects

  • conormunsonconormunson Monthly Member
    10 karma

    I've paid for the Starter, which is all I've really needed, but this isn't enough to continue to view the explanations? I'm writing on the 25th of November, would hate to lose access 10 days before the test. Any way around this?

  • _aisling__aisling_ Alum Member
    289 karma

    @conormunson said:
    I've paid for the Starter, which is all I've really needed, but this isn't enough to continue to view the explanations? I'm writing on the 25th of November, would hate to lose access 10 days before the test. Any way around this?

    I'm in the same boat, Conor. I imagine that they've done the math and that paying the royalties per view just isn't cost-effective for someone who only paid for Starter. :( But I'm also uncomfortable paying an extra $170 for 10 days of access leading up to the exam. Ultimately, though, that's a choice that could be made.

  • NanaimomooseNanaimomoose Alum Member
    60 karma

    This is profoundly upsetting. :(

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