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Got too many wrongs in LR, feeling hopeless.

cnguye15cnguye15 Legacy Member
in General 64 karma
For some reasons, I spent most of my time on practicing LR and it is so far my worst section. Just took Pt47 today and got 22 wrong in LR. The breakdown is -5 RC -3LG -8LR and -14 LR (third section). I am pretty disappointed because i was doing pretty well on LR individual sections. The questions weren't that hard, i only had to guess two questions for each section. I basically went over the entire 7 sage curriculum twice. For past months, i've worked on old LR sections (p44 backward). My LR strategy is reading the stimulus, question stem and pick the correct answer choice. I rarely used POE unless it was a hard question. I tried reading stem first but i got distracted so I changed the approach. I will retake the test this oct. I did so bad on LR and RC for the previous test so i ended up canceling it. Now my RC seems ok, but LR is getting worse. This is my second pt after the first exam. Did anyone have this problem and overcome it? I'd appreciate if you share your experience.

Comments

  • GSU HopefulGSU Hopeful Monthly
    1644 karma
    Have you read The Trainer? If you haven't, I would highly suggest in doing so. Prior to my reading it, I rarely used POE. But, after reading the Trainer and letting Kim's statement that almost all high scorers invariably use POE, I began to incorporate POE into my game. Just that alone improved my score. And, the concepts and methodology that The Trainer teaches helped me improve a lot. What types of questions are you struggling with? What does your blind review scores look like and how are you blind reviewing?
  • c.janson35c.janson35 Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    2398 karma
    It sounds like you would definitely benefit from using POE to confirm both incorrect and correct answers. If you aren't eliminating answers just by the process of going through them, then it would be hard to have confidence in the answer you are selecting. This is probably happening to you if you are only guessing on 2 questions yet are still getting 22 incorrect. Part of the process of answering questions is both affirming the correct answer and denying the incorrect ones. When you blind review, definitely concentrate on the thought processes you use to select a correct answer, justify your answer, and articulate why the answers you didn't select are incorrect. After all, understanding why an answer is incorrect is as important to your studies as knowing why an answer is correct.
  • GSU HopefulGSU Hopeful Monthly
    1644 karma
    @c.janson35 said:
    After all, understanding why an answer is incorrect is as important to your studies as knowing why an answer is correct.
    Absolutely! Well put!
  • mikeysaikaleymikeysaikaley Alum Member
    116 karma
    Just out of curiosity, if you could do POE in a timing effecient manner, why is it frowned upon? I just started studying a week ago, but I always use POE.
  • Matt1234567Matt1234567 Legacy Inactive ⭐
    1294 karma
    @mikeysaikaley said:
    Just out of curiosity, if you could do POE in a timing effecient manner, why is it frowned upon?
    I don't think it's frowned upon. Using POE is encouraged and will help you pick answer choices confidently. Not only that, but it will help you with seeing the patterns of wrong answer choices and the traps and tricks the writers use.
  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Legacy Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    7965 karma
    @mikeysaikaley said:
    if you could do POE in a timing effecient manner, why is it frowned upon?
    No one would ever frown upon POE except for:

    image

    Even LSAC recommends it in their Superprep. Everyone worth a single grain of salt recommends (and in fact uses) POE.
  • MoosaderMoosader Alum Member
    234 karma
    The Trainer is definitely my number one recommendation. But, I am going through the LR Bible, and it does have some explanations you could benefit from. I do not recommend this if you get confused easily. Keep the Trainer and 7sage as your foundation, but I would advise implementing some techniques in the Bible. Specifically in your case, the LR Bible has a semi-wonderful explanation of the wrong answer choices and the "Traps" the LSAC puts on LR. Although so far I have identified one certain flaw in the organization of wrong answer types, these explanations have helped me a lot.

    Also, I haven't gone through it yet, I will go through it very quickly over the next 2 or 3 days (very quickly), but Manhattan LR is only 10$ on amazon for the kindle price. That might help.

    LR is my worst section too. Here's what I'm doing (for October) for LR. 1. The Trainer is my foundation. 2. Supplementing Trainer with some insights from the Bible and Manhattan. 3. Organizing strategy (with Trainer as main, and couple tidbits from the others) according to question type and drilling a study sheet (complete with how to do each question, typical wrong answer per question, possible right answer each question, and how to help if stuck) for memorization. 4. After memorizing, I'm going through Cambridge 1-20. 5. Review each question type like BR, and comparing each q I got wrong to my study guide method to see where I went wrong. 6. If necessary, I'll buy 7sage and work their curriculum in, but I would like to save that money for a tutor.

    I consider this to be as comprehensive as possible, but I'll also have the luxury of studying full-time. The Trainer, on its own, and drilling with Cambridge, is in my opinion the most bang for buck and time. Good luck
  • gs556gs556 Legacy Member Inactive Sage
    568 karma
    My advice:

    The answer choices are not your friend! Use POE to eliminate the dirty bastards. It is, by far, the best strategy to doing well on LR. There are too many tempting answer choices to choose from. Look for reasons to disqualify an answe choice rather than reasons you think it's right.
  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Legacy Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    7965 karma
    @gs556 said:
    Look for reasons to disqualify an answe choice rather than reasons you think it's right.
    Exactly!
  • cnguye15cnguye15 Legacy Member
    64 karma
    I finished the trainer. The problem is that it was hard to incorporate Trainer's POE techniques in real test situation. I tried POE but it seems to slow me down because it takes time to cross out all answer choices sometime. So usually I only put a "C" for a contender. And usually I am often left with 2 choices and always pick the wrong one because i don't know why one answer is better than the other so i just use my intuition. I think I will try to slow down a bit and refrain from rereading the stimulus, which i do a lot for long stimuli to understand the argument.
    I 've been following Grameke Blake's LR tips, which emphasize a lot on understanding the stimulus because when you fully understand the stimulus, the correct answer choice will be easier to spot. It may work well on RC but not for LR and I don't know why. So if slow down to answer 22 questions so i have time for POE then would it improve my accuracy? I would also appreciate if someone can tell me how you read LR stimuli normally. What is your thought process? It seems to me that it helps a lot if you know how to read LR stimuli effectively. Thanks for yo all


  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Legacy Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    edited July 2015 7965 karma
    @cnguye15 said:
    The problem is that it was hard to incorporate Trainer's POE techniques in real test situation. I tried POE but it seems to slow me down because it takes time to cross out all answer choices sometime.
    You'll get faster with practice. And you're selling yourself short by bypassing it (in other words, by not practicing it) now. It's that simple. Top scorers use POE. Period.

    image
  • Alex ShortAlex Short Alum Member
    112 karma
    In a lot of LR review, I've learned a few things that I can tell you that may help you quickly - that is to say, other than just practicing.

    Make sure you're 100% able to ID the conclusion and support given for it. And as you read, try to put the argument into more simple terms... the test will absolutely try to tie you up with bad grammar.

    For me, it takes about 5-15 seconds to eliminate 3, if not 4 answer choices. Depending on the question type... reasons re: why change. For example, for an inference question, look for "some" or weaker language in the correct answer. Not always, but at least sometimes...

    Do not be afraid to sit and read a question you just don't "get" over and over, out loud, as if teaching it, etc, whatever works! Literally - if it takes 30 minutes for it to click in your mind, you're all set. Best 30 minutes of prep possible.

    It looks like you've already decided you can't do LR that well, and each post appears to justify why you can't or what you'll do. The test will be here sooner than we think. If you're serious about law as a career, get going!

    And seriously, POE is just a necessary component to doing well in LR. No way around it. It doesn't take longer - and if it did, it nets more correct answers for sure. Just accept that and move on. Good luck
  • goalis180goalis180 Alum Member
    531 karma
    OP you must use POE, unless your intuition has NEVER, and I mean that in the LSAT literal term, NEVER failed you, or you are a genius and this test in cake for you. Sometimes I look at answer choices that look like their right, but they are just worded soo crazy, that I am just not confident I get it, so i just solidify my understanding by eliminating all of the other ones. In my opinion this test is more about picking up on the wrong answer than the right ones. This test is difficult due to the fact that the wrong answer choices are very attractive in some instances, not that the right answer is easy to spot (something I have begun to notice the more I study). Which is one of the reasons the BR method is just so crucial to studying. Understanding why the wrong answers are wrong will help you see the pattern in wrong answer, and your elimination skills just get good enough to where the correct answer is just easier to see, and you just start eliminating for confidence. If it is taking you so long to eliminate answers then you must go over your fundamentals, they are everything. I feel like some of the questions you are able to get down to 2 AC's fairly quick. you can do it, but it takes time, hard work, and dedication.
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