Which References Carry More Weight?

paulmv.benthem

Hey all,

I have a question regarding references on which I'd be interested to hear some thoughts. I'm a Canadian applicant, and I've already submitted my applications for Ontario law schools, which allow three referees. However, I am just finishing up applications for UBC, UVic, and Dalhousie. UVic does not accept LORs (which, in my opinion, lowers their program on my list...but, anyway). UBC and Dalhousie, on the other hand, ask for only 2 letters. Thus, I'm in a position where I have to decide which two referees to ask to submit letters to these schools. Here are a few relevant specs for each referee.

Referee #1: An Associate Professor in psychology who I completed roughly 8 courses with over the duration of my program. I haven't seen the letter he wrote, but I often received back positive comments on my performance and a few times he asked if he could provide my papers as a model for future students in particular courses that he taught. However, I never worked as a TA or research assistant for this individual.

Referee #2: Instructor in sociology. Due to a health condition, he is not able to fulfill the requirements to be a full professor at this time, keeping him at the rank of instructor. However, he does have his doctorate from a prestigious American university. I worked as a TA for him for 4 years, returning each year at his own request. I also worked as a research assistant for him during a summer. I expect the letter would be quite good.

Referee#3: The Vice-President Academic of the university where I graduated. Unfortunately, I never completed any courses with him. Our relationship revolves around his supervising an academic writing fellowship that I was offered, and am now completing, at the the university. His comments to me have been favorable, and he described his letter as "glowing." However, I know that the amount of personal experience with me that he has to drawn on is more limited than the other two. At the same time, his title is impressive.

In many respects, the question this comes down to is...Do admissions committees tend to regard more highly the title/position of the referee or the amount of experience shared with the applicant? Thoughts?

Rigid Designator

@"paulmv.benthem" said:
Do admissions committees tend to regard more highly the title/position of the referee or the amount of experience shared with the applicant?

The latter. Knowledge of the candidate trumps rank any day of the week.

teamteamvicster

Agree with above. Relationships carry waaaayyy more weight. I would go with the first referee who can speak to your academic abilities and the second who can speak to your professional working style. It seems like all three wrote you good letters, so I think you'll be in a nice position either way. Best of luck!

BreannaE

Hey! @"paulmv.benthem" Fellow Canadian Law school applicant here. Are you applying to the Regular Applicant category for UBC, because to my knowledge they do not require any letters of recommendation.

paulmv.benthem

@"Rigid Designator" & @teamteamvicster , thanks for the comments. I also chatted with a couple of the proffs at the school where I work, and they agreed with you guys--go for someone who has experience on which to draw.

@BreannaE , ah...that is a point with which I've been wrestling. I am apply as a Regular Applicant. However, I did read on another law students forum that some students who were applying in this category did have reference letters sent in, and UBC did indicate that these letters were reviewed. I'm still debating whether I'll ask my referees to send in a letter. Thoughts?

breanna.elizebeth

@"paulmv.benthem" Hey yeah I saw that forum here on this site as well! I thought the conclusion that they came to was well thought out. The only reason why I am hesitant is because I do not want to ask too much of my recommender. My recommender would also be the same one for scholarships that I would potentially be applying to and I am not sure how it looks to whomever is on these committees to have the same letter for both... But yeah I think the consensus was that it would submitting the reference letter was that there was "no harm, no foul"

Leah M B

Generally, the wisdom is that you want your LOR to be from people who have good, personal knowledge of your abilities and that is preferred over someone with a fancy title. So, I'd say the first 2 and leave out the third unless needed for some reason.

However, I'm also not familiar with Canadian schools at all, but I do know they have some different expectations with admissions (like they view personal statements differently than the US schools). Maybe @keets993 has some insight too?

FixedDice

Referee#3: [...] he described his letter as "glowing."

"Most professors think they are A+, world-class recommendation writers when in fact... most are far from it. If a professor shows off about how great his recommendations are, don't assume it's true. Better to run far away -- in my experience, those are the people who are the most clueless about what a good law school recommendation looks like." (The Ivey Guide to Law School Admissions, 109.)

keets993

@"Leah M B" has summoned me.

BTW I don't think UofT looks at references either.

I think experience with you is probably better. That being said, I'm sure they all have some standard letter that they edit to tailor for each student. So the better they know you, the more individualized it be.