June vs. October LSAT

fifthending

Hey guys,

I'm planning to apply for law school this coming fall and would like to attend the fall of 2016. I had been planning on taking the lsat this June, and I've been studying since about October of 2014. Though it's been about 6 months, it hasn't really been intensive studying, just fitting it in with college and work, here and there, etc. I can do some intensive studying beginning in May for a little less than a month right before the test and I'm wondering whether I should just take it in June and then take it again in October, or wait until October. I feel like I'd do better in October after having the entire summer to really study but if I don't take the June test, October will be the first and last time I'll be able to take it (and still be able to apply on time). Any advice would be appreciated

mes08

I'm basically in the same situation as you and would recommend that you wait to take it in October. Not only will you have a greater mastery of the material after having studied more intensively over the summer, but you'll probably have more confidence the day of the test. Even if you're scoring well now, the higher the score, the better (for chances of admission as well as scholarship money). Worst case scenario is that you take it again in December. While that's not ideal, my impression is that a higher score is much more valuable than an earlier application submission.

Thesurrealbird

Thank you for asking this question I am in the same position!

dhernan01

Why wouldn't you take it both times? Almost every school only takes the higher score.

nicole.hopkins

@dhernan01 The policy varies from school to school. Some schools do consider all scores though they give slightly higher weight to the highest score. Some schools average scores (NYU for instance).

blah170blah

@nicole.hopkins Girl, is that your love for UT shining through right now?

@dhernan01 and @fifthending The policy does vary from school to school but it is fairly typical that schools will take your highest score. Not even Yale explicitly states that they will average scores.

Also, while I do think the advice that "law school will always be here" is sage, I do wonder why with 6.5 weeks left, you're already asking yourself this question. Depending on where you are and where you want to get, 6.5 weeks of intense studying can get you to where you want to go. If you truly believe that the extra months in the summer are going to be beneficial, than by all means take it.

If there's actually an additional reason (scared to take the exam, fear of failure, berating yourself for not studying harder in the past, etc.), I think you should reconsider your desire to postpone. I've postponed the test since October 2013 -- that's right, not 2014, 2013, which means I've been "studying" for the past 2 years -- except that I wasn't studying nearly as intense as I should have been. Instead, I kept postponing it thinking that all the anxieties I felt towards the exam would just magically dissipate and that during the summer I could just go from being a chronic procrastinator to studying 8 hours a day. Lo and behold, it didn't actually work like that (for me). So I kept on postponing, waiting for that magical "get your stuff together woman!" to hit, not giving it my all, with the security that I could postpone whenever. June for me is a hard deadline. If I get the inkling that I want to postpone to October, it's because I know that I feel guilty for not studying as much as I need to be, not because I can't actually accomplish my goals within the next month and a half.

YOU CAN DO IT OP :]

nicole.hopkins

@blah170blah SHHH they'll hear you ... o.0

kaylam28

I am in a very similar situation. I have been studying about 25 hours a week through 7Sage for a few months. I know I can do a lot better on the October test with the extra study time, but I am planning on taking the June test as well so I have two shots in case something goes wrong. I also believe I can still do well on the June test because I am currently scoring around an acceptable level for me and still have weeks to prepare. All of the schools I am considering look at your highest score, and have told me a previous lower score does not really hurt you, unless it is very, very low.

justrandom

@blah170blah . You seriously articulated my thoughts exactly!

emli1000

I would most likely consider Oct. being that you don't have much time left for the June LSAT. Also are you reaching your target score now? Or could you improve more? I remember watching a video from JY or Jon about how nobody wants to sit again for the LSAT. If you can do it once and do well then why go through the whole studying again for the 2nd time? What if you've covered all of the material already and so on. I now know that for the LSAT you should never rush... Because it can lead to disappointment and also hinder you from reaching your goal.

blah170blah

@justrandom SOLIDARY SISTAAA (or MISTA -- you can never tell with these funky little gravatars) :]

msoliviaj

Wow @blah170blah you came right on time! I needed to hear that... June Here WE COME

fifthending

@nicole.hopkins noooo, NYU is pretty much my top school

So given that they take the average of your scores, that makes me a little less inclined to take it in June. I haven't gotten through all the material yet (I haven't even gotten to taking all the preptests yet) but my score when I took the practice test cold before 7sage was 150...I don't know if that matters. I just don't want October to be my last and only opportunity to take it...what if something goes wrong? But thanks for all the input guys, I'll give it a bit more thought

ddakjiking

I'd be willing to bet that NYU will still take your highest score, contrary to what they say on their website. You've heard this before but the pool of super scorers (170+) are still down this cycle and schools like NYU/Columbia can't afford to be so picky when a good amount of them will go to Harvard/Yale/Stanford for the prestige. @fifthending

nicole.hopkins

@fifthending from NYU Law's FAQ:

If I take the LSAT more than once, does the Committee see the higher score?

Yes, but they evaluate based on the average score in most cases. The Committee may take special circumstances into account. If a candidate can point out specific reasons why the Committee should consider an LSAT score aberrant, they should detail those reasons in an addendum to the personal statement.

nicole.hopkins

@ddakjiking You like to live dangerously, I see Top scorers are top scorers—maybe there are fewer but for the #6 law school in the country, my guess is that things are business as usual more or less (at least insofar as considering an averaged score is concerned). I just ... Wouldn't want to give someone bad advice and have them take the LSAT when they're not ready and end up with a low score that would bring down even the highest score possible.

Just saying. Caution is warranted.

blah170blah

but my score when I took the practice test cold before 7sage was 150...I don't know if that matters.

Your diagnostic score doesn't matter as much as how you're scoring now. If you're aiming for NYU, assuming you're at the median for GPA (and not too much higher or lower), you'd need a high 160 low 170 score. If you've taken PTs and are scoring in the mid 160s, I'd say you have a decent shot of bumping that up to where you want to be for NYU. If you haven't taken any PTs yet and have barely made a dent to your curriculum, then I would postpone until October just because making a 10-15 point jump is very difficult to accomplish with less than 2 months left.

fifthending

I think I will end up postponing until Oct then. NYU says the latest score they'll accept for Fall 2016 is December 2015 - do you think there are any downsides to potentially having to take it again then (besides the application being a bit rushed, etc.)?

rblackshear

take it all three times if you like. they will take the highest despite their policy.

fifthending

@rblackshear @ddakjiking what sort of awesome super power lets you know this? 0_0

nicole.hopkins

@rblackshear Why ... would you say that?

nicole.hopkins

I would tread lightly with this advice given in wanton disregard of stated policies :-/

ddakjiking

I live under a different alias on TLS and follow every post in their admission subform almost religiously. It might have been the case 5 years when applications were at its peak that tops schools would have averaged scores but schools are in a drought so to speak.

http://spiveyconsulting.com/blog/near-complete-201415-cycle-data/

Spivey just released another update on this cycle and the reoccuring theme is that 170+ scorers are way down. Top schools with large class sizes like Harvard, NYU, Columbia (350+ppl) can't afford to be key word *as* picky compared to 5 years ago.

This is just one man's opinion from following TLS where there are a lot of T14 0L gunners as well as current students.

blah170blah

I think if you're going to be a splitter case then applying early is advantageous. There isn't necessarily a disadvantage to apply in November or December but there is an advantage to applying earlier. I agree with @ddakjiking that NYU will most likely just take your highest score given the law school market as is.

However, applying early will not compensate for a subpar lsat score. If you think waiting until October will be the difference from a 165 to a 169-171, then I think you should wait. If you're in the 168-170 range now, haul ass and take it.

emli1000

Btw, you can always submit your app before you take the LSAT. The sooner the better. That's what I did.. Since you'll indicate that you will be taking the LSAT in Oct/Dec most schools will hold your app until they receive your LSAT score.

emli1000

Also with the comments above... I wouldn't recommend that you take the LSAT multiple times. It''s not fun. It will be better if you take it once and reach your score because just imagine all of the time you've spent on LSAT prep... Imagine going through that intense prep again and again? Like many on here have said before do not take the LSAT if you do not feel prepared. I wish I would have known this before I took the LSAT. I rushed to get it out of the way. My avg. score was decent enough while I was prepping to get into my school. But I could have waited and taken the LSAT in Feb. instead of Dec. and I was working full-time with about 20 hrs per week for LSAT.

mes08

@emli1000 YES, couldn't agree more. Having to retake the LSAT because you rushed yourself/weren't 100% ready totally sucks. Pushing yourself to re-start the rigorous study schedule after a less than satisfactory score is even worse. I was going to retake in June but didn't want to make the same mistake again. Taking it in October instead when I hope to be fully prepared.

nicole.hopkins

Also, I hate to be that deflating voice of financial responsibility ... But why waste $170 ?!?? Even if it's not your own money you're spending ;-)

NYC12345

@fifthending While most schools do only consider the top score and the schools who claim to average multiple scores will most likely give more weight to the higher score, the goal is to only take the test once. You should not plan on retaking the test. A retake is simply a last resort. Planning on a retake is like telling yourself that you are not going to do well on the first try, and going into the test with that mindset is a sure way not to score at your maximum potential. My advice is to take the test when you are most confident that you are going to be at your very best.
Oh, and in terms of NYU, even though they claim to average multiple scores on their website, it is buyer's market, so I highly doubt that NYU, or any school for that matter will turn down a stellar lsat score. For example, suppose one scores a 155 the first time around, but scores a 172 on a retake. The average would be a 163.5; however, do you really think they would view it as a 163 when they will have to report it to the ABA as a 172? My educated guess is that it's highly unlikely. Take the test when you are good and ready.

nicole.hopkins

@alexandergreene93 wins the prize* for most reasoned argument in this thread!

*(Assuming there could be such a prize and that I would be the most appropriate person to award it ... one of those assumptions is false and the other is highly, highly dubious)

Seriously though, I heartily agree with the critique of the "retake" mindset.

emli1000

@mes08 true. at least this time around you'll be more prepared! And actually know a lot more and know that your score will reflect your avg. PT score. I wish you the best on the Oct. LSAT!

visualcreed

I vote for October, I wish I could postpone because I actually think a 170+ for me could happen if I wait until then. My plan is to be in school this coming fall so I have no choice to take the June test but if you have the choice I'd take it when you think you'll feel the most confident. I agree with the no retake thoughts as well. Why would I go in thinking I have another chance if I fail? That's total lack of confidence.