PT 70.S4.Q14 - Epic poetry

lsat2021-1

Hi can someone explain why D is wrong? I understand that it might be due to the invalid generalization. We know that epic poetry transmits values "by which a group of people is to live." We know it accomplishes this by embodying those values in heroic figures. However, we can't definitely conclude that epic poetry performs this function for "many groups of people," as choice (D) indicates. But I am confused because of the term "A". I think "a" means a general scenario, and the statement can apply to any/all group of ppl so wouldn't then the application of this model "a group" be applicable to the "many group"?

Also my issue with the answer choice B is that it mentions 'most' and under time pressure I applied Loopholes provable-powerful method and eliminated B because the 'most' was a powerful indicator word. For those who have read loophole have you also come across such situations, what do you do?

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Logician

Hey there,
Heres a quick breakdown of the question.

Prem: The most important function of epic poetry is to transmit the values by which a group of people is to live.
Prem: This transmission is done via embodiment in heoric figures who are presented as role models
Prem: Imitating those role models (heroic figures) gives meaning and direction to the lives of those who hear the poems.

Inference: the most important function of epic poetry is carried out via role models (heroic figures)

A) This talks about POETRY, the stimulus discusses EPIC poetry. Toss it.

B- This is supported by the stim and must be true according to the information we're given. Keep in mind "most" in this answer choice is qualifying the degree of importance- which is explicitly stated in the stimulus. "most" in this sense is not referring to a numeric relationship. This answer choice is essentially just detailing the mechanism by which EP accomplishes its most important function.

In regards to the loophole, i'm assuming the context Ellen Cassidy is referring to is the unsubstantiated "most", which is usually acting as the existential qualifier denoting numeric relationships. However, in this case Cassidy's powerful provable does not apply as the AC matches the language (power) seen in the stimulus. As a rule of thumb, don't blindly abide by the powerful vs provable model- sure its great, but it also needs to be understood in context. It's not some iron clad rule that can be applied to every and any situation.

C) extremely vague and also not supported by the stim, like answer choice A, this talks about poetry, not EPIC poetry.

D) This is also not supported by the stim. Stack this up against B and you will see the difference. B denotes the mechanism by which EP accomplishes its most important function. Whereas this answer choice goes a step further and says that the most important function of epic poetry is actually being carried out on a group of people. In other words, some people are hearing epic poems. But we don't know this based on the stim. Toss it.

E) Again, not supported. For all we know multiple other things have an identical function.

Hope this helped!

lsat2021-1

Hi thanks for your thorough reply!

I am afraid I am still a little confused about D. I hope my question makes sense but will give it another shot.

When you say "Whereas this answer choice goes a step further and says that the most important function of epic poetry is actually being carried out on a group of people" do you mean to say that "a group of people" here is used in the numeric relationship sense which is why "a group of people" is not equal to "many groups of people"? I think my confusion stems from the sentence "The most important function of epic poetry is to transmit the values by which a group of people is to live" as I perceived the mention of "a group of people live" here as a model group rather than a singular group and didn't catch this as a numeric difference when I came to answer choice D. Thanks for your help!

@Logician said:
Hey there,
Heres a quick breakdown of the question.

Prem: The most important function of epic poetry is to transmit the values by which a group of people is to live.
Prem: This transmission is done via embodiment in heoric figures who are presented as role models
Prem: Imitating those role models (heroic figures) gives meaning and direction to the lives of those who hear the poems.

Inference: the most important function of epic poetry is carried out via role models (heroic figures)

A) This talks about POETRY, the stimulus discusses EPIC poetry. Toss it.

B- This is supported by the stim and must be true according to the information we're given. Keep in mind "most" in this answer choice is qualifying the degree of importance- which is explicitly stated in the stimulus. "most" in this sense is not referring to a numeric relationship. This answer choice is essentially just detailing the mechanism by which EP accomplishes its most important function.

In regards to the loophole, i'm assuming the context Ellen Cassidy is referring to is the unsubstantiated "most", which is usually acting as the existential qualifier denoting numeric relationships. However, in this case Cassidy's powerful provable does not apply as the AC matches the language (power) seen in the stimulus. As a rule of thumb, don't blindly abide by the powerful vs provable model- sure its great, but it also needs to be understood in context. It's not some iron clad rule that can be applied to every and any situation.

C) extremely vague and also not supported by the stim, like answer choice A, this talks about poetry, not EPIC poetry.

D) This is also not supported by the stim. Stack this up against B and you will see the difference. B denotes the mechanism by which EP accomplishes its most important function. Whereas this answer choice goes a step further and says that the most important function of epic poetry is actually being carried out on a group of people. In other words, some people are hearing epic poems. But we don't know this based on the stim. Toss it.

E) Again, not supported. For all we know multiple other things have an identical function.

Hope this helped!

Logician

When you say "Whereas this answer choice goes a step further and says that the most important function of epic poetry is actually being carried out on a group of people" do you mean to say that "a group of people" here is used in the numeric relationship sense which is why "a group of people" is not equal to "many groups of people"? I think my confusion stems from the sentence "The most important function of epic poetry is to transmit the values by which a group of people is to live" as I perceived the mention of "a group of people live" here as a model group rather than a singular group and didn't catch this as a numeric difference when I came to answer choice D. Thanks for your help!

So the language "some" in answer choice D implies at least one group of people. The reason D is wrong is not because of the distinction of at least one group (or "a group") vs several groups, but rather because the answer choice is saying that groups of people (or even a single group of people) are hearing epic poems- which based on the stimulus we cannot infer. All we know is the mechanism by which epic poetry carries out its most important function, we don't know whether or not there has been an instance in which epic poetry carried out said function.

I hope that clears it up!

lsat2021-1

Ah I see, so the reason the AC is incorrect because of the something can happen vs something is happening error. Thank you so much for clarifying this!!!

@Logician said:

When you say "Whereas this answer choice goes a step further and says that the most important function of epic poetry is actually being carried out on a group of people" do you mean to say that "a group of people" here is used in the numeric relationship sense which is why "a group of people" is not equal to "many groups of people"? I think my confusion stems from the sentence "The most important function of epic poetry is to transmit the values by which a group of people is to live" as I perceived the mention of "a group of people live" here as a model group rather than a singular group and didn't catch this as a numeric difference when I came to answer choice D. Thanks for your help!

So the language "some" in answer choice D implies at least one group of people. The reason D is wrong is not because of the distinction of at least one group (or "a group") vs several groups, but rather because the answer choice is saying that groups of people (or even a single group of people) are hearing epic poems- which based on the stimulus we cannot infer. All we know is the mechanism by which epic poetry carries out its most important function, we don't know whether or not there has been an instance in which epic poetry carried out said function.

I hope that clears it up!