LSAT PT Untimed?

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• 3 Likes

  Cant Get Right Yearly + Live Member Sage ⭐ 🍌 7Sage Tutor

  October 2017 27900 karma

  Untimed work is really great for learning the fundamentals. Once you've got each section where you need to be, it's time to work on strategy. LSAT time management is a very specific skill. It's dependent on, but very different from, the fundamentals. I think once you've gotten your BR score consistently in about the 170 range, you want to shift pretty exclusively to timed sections/tests. Until then, you'll likely have better returns working on the fundamentals. Once you've got that under your belt, study strategy and time management to close the gap. That should put you where you want to be.
• 1 Like

  LivePumpkin Free Trial Member

  October 2017 270 karma

  @"Cant Get Right" I think that is a good approach. I am reading in a lot of posts (including yours) about fundamentals. I’m sorry if this is redundant but could you explain a bit more? In particular, about your comments on working on fundamentals untimed. Thanks !
• Alex Alum Member ⭐

  October 2017 23929 karma

  @Nunuboy1994 said:
  Hey everyone,

  So I was hoping you guys could give me some feedback on my recent LSAT studies. I am planning to eventually take the LSAT as I want to earn a JD/MBA. I was studying for the LSAT from January 2016- August 2016 and soon stopped because it got to be too much with my classes; I am a senior majoring earning a degree in business administration. I had quit also because of frustration. I was hitting 154-160 on timed practice tests in August 2016 after studying all Spring and summer; I felt that logical reasoning became my most consistent section as I progressed from getting only 5 per section wrong untimed to timed. My performance on logic games and reading comp was very fickle, though oddly on a good day my highest section scores have been in those sections. Anyways I digress. I took an untimed practice test recently after several months of not studying and got a 165 untimed. This is the highest I've ever gotten untimed and I would honestly be satisfied with anything above a 162 on test day. At this point should I start going back to timed practice? Even though I haven't studied for several months I feel like taking a break has really given me a fresh perspective, but I'm just scared to go straight back into timed practice. Also I don't feel like it make sense to try and postpone practice until you get a 175+...maybe 170. How can I get a 162+

  If you're looking for a 162+ then I would probably follow @"Cant Get Right" 's advice pretty closely. If you're scoring a 165 untimed, then I think there may still be some advantages to doing untimed work, especially with fundamentals.

  You will definitely want to ease into timed work by doing timed sections. Eventually doing untimed work is going to lead to diminishing returns.
• Nunuboy1994 Free Trial Member

  October 2017 edited October 2017 346 karma

  Well, I think what is meant by fundamentals is how well you actually understand the question. More simply, can you comprehend the stimulus and answer choices and then eliminate and select the right answers? Can you at least eliminate the question to two choices? Also, when I was scoring in the 153-160 range a year ago I noticed not much difference between my BR's and PT's. In terms of drilling, my LR accuracy untime began to match my accuracy timed. I've seen most fluctuations come from LG and RC sections. I'm hoping to realistically just get a 162+. Is this realistic give my BR? I know BR's aren't perfect indicators but I feel like I understand everything a lot better and scoring 170 BR would be a reasonable benchmark to hit 162+ real thing.
• Nunuboy1994 Free Trial Member

  October 2017 346 karma

  One thing I wanted to add is that the highest BR I got last year was like159. The last pt I took was a few weeks after that and I got 160 but I didn't BR on that one.
• 1 Like

  Alex Alum Member ⭐

  October 2017 23929 karma

  @Nunuboy1994 said:
  Well, I think what is meant by fundamentals is how well you actually understand the question. More simply, can you comprehend the stimulus and answer choices and then eliminate and select the right answers? Can you at least eliminate the question to two choices? Also, when I was scoring in the 153-160 range a year ago I noticed not much difference between my BR's and PT's. In terms of drilling, my LR accuracy untime began to match my accuracy untimed. I've seen most fluctuations come from LG and RC sections. I'm hoping to realistically just get a 162+. Is this realistic give my BR? I know BR's aren't perfect indicators but I feel like I understand everything a lot better and scoring 170 BR would be a reasonable benchmark to hit 162+ real thing.

  Yes, a 162 is 100% realistic.

  I would highly recommend a 7Sage Course so you have some sort of structured prep and drilling materials. I would be willing to bet that if you completed the 7sage core curriculum and drilled properly, you would be scoring in the 160 range pretty easily.
• 1 Like

  akistotle Member ⭐ 🍌🍌

  October 2017 edited October 2017 9382 karma

  @"Alex Divine" said:

  @Nunuboy1994 said:
  Well, I think what is meant by fundamentals is how well you actually understand the question. More simply, can you comprehend the stimulus and answer choices and then eliminate and select the right answers? Can you at least eliminate the question to two choices? Also, when I was scoring in the 153-160 range a year ago I noticed not much difference between my BR's and PT's. In terms of drilling, my LR accuracy untime began to match my accuracy untimed. I've seen most fluctuations come from LG and RC sections. I'm hoping to realistically just get a 162+. Is this realistic give my BR? I know BR's aren't perfect indicators but I feel like I understand everything a lot better and scoring 170 BR would be a reasonable benchmark to hit 162+ real thing.

  Yes, a 162 is 100% realistic.

  I would highly recommend a 7Sage Course so you have some sort of structured prep and drilling materials. I would be willing to bet that if you completed the 7sage core curriculum and drilled properly, you would be scoring in the 160 range pretty easily.

  I may be wrong, but it seems like you ( @Nunuboy1994 ) did not spend much time learning the fundamentals. I don't know which courses/textbooks you use, but I think even 170+ is totally realistic for you if you find the right prep method. And as @"Alex Divine" did, I recommend 7Sage.
• Cant Get Right Yearly + Live Member Sage ⭐ 🍌 7Sage Tutor

  October 2017 27900 karma

  @LivePumpkin said:
  @"Cant Get Right" I think that is a good approach. I am reading in a lot of posts (including yours) about fundamentals. I’m sorry if this is redundant but could you explain a bit more? In particular, about your comments on working on fundamentals untimed. Thanks !

  Happy to LP.

  So fundamentals are probably best measured with BR score. They are your raw ability to understand the underlying logic and language of each stimulus/passage/game. If you don't possess the basic fundamental abilities you need to answer a particular question correctly, then you just can't answer it correctly without lucking into a blind guess. For example, conditional reasoning is not something most of us have been exposed to before the LSAT. If you don't know the basic mechanics of how conditional statements function, you really don't have any business thinking you can answer a question correctly if it deals with conditionality--timed or not. There a lot of these types of concepts, and each one goes pretty deep and has many fundamental subparts. Before you master these elements of the test, taking timed sections isn't going to be very productive. If you don't understand the nature of the relationship between a necessary and sufficient condition, all the time in the world is not going to help you on a conditional logic heavy stimulus. This is something that needs to be addressed before you can even hope to deal with the time aspect. So in this stage of your prep, working untimed is much better.