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Should you go to a law school you don't want or should you try the LSAT again?
Hello sagers. I am in doubt about this. I have a terrific GPA in undergrad. 3.85. My LSAT performance is dismal. I am thinking of accepting an offer from a school which accepts lower tiers LSAT and possibly transfer from there to my school of choice later. is that a good strategy? I don't want to lose anymore time on dreaming im going to do well on the LSAT. I really dont have time to study like many of you i must work for a living and its hard to find time, even tough i put at least 20 hours a week to study. im all over the place. sometimes i do well sometimes i do not so i really cant gauge my level of performance.....
i really want to put the lsat on my rearviewmirror and start law school asap. I know I will do well in law school. its my dream to be there and I will succeed, but the lsat is really pushing me back.
Should i persist on the LSAT or should i enroll in a school that is not really a choice.....and try to transfer.
What say you?
Any comments are welcome.
Comments
Definitely retake the LSAT. Transferring is never a sure-fire thing. And one thing that really stuck with me when I was faced with the same situation was that never go to a school you can't see yourself graduating from. I retook the LSAT and got into my number one choice after waiting and studying a year longer than I wanted to. Hope this helps!
On a related note, scholarship money is always a crap-shoot with transfers (from what I have heard and read at least).
RETAKE!
You might be in for a rather unpleasant surprise...
Transferring is based on a number of big, big, big, big assumptions. Some of them may well turn out to be false. In a law school, you will be competing against others who are approximately as intelligent and driven as you are. Some of them probably want to transfer too. With all due respect, if your LSAT performance really is as unstable as you claim it to be, why would you think your law school performance - which I hear is far more demanding than the LSAT - will consistently outshine those of your peers, to the extent you will be admitted to a (presumably) higher-ranked institution? Students from other law schools would apply to your school of choice too.
I say retake. It's not as potentially costly as opting for a school you don't like is.
I really think it would be a mistake to commit to a school you don't want to attend. Transferring is difficult, and even if you were able to do it, you often don't get any scholarship money.
There are a lot of us around here that work full time (I do too!) and can totally empathize with how tough it is to fit in both things and not lose your mind. You're not alone in that struggle. I think it's important for those of us that work to be really efficient in studying. Quality over quantity.
Especially with that good of a GPA, I really believe you could improve your LSAT score. If you want any help or advice, feel free to let us know and the community here is great at brainstorming ways to improve.
The 7sage community is always going to tell you to retake in this type of situation. Everyone wants to start law school right now but it just doesn't happen that way for most people. You need to give yourself plenty of time to study so that you understand your potential. If you settle for a score in the 150's with a GPA like that I think you're taking on needless risk and probably a heck of a lot more work in the future. Put the effort in now, bite the bullet and delay for another cycle. Block out time every week to study and be diligent. It's a test, everyone can improve. You just need to give yourself enough time to do so.
The number of people asking this question is amazing to me...
Would you buy a car you didn't like? Would you order a meal you didn't like? Would you buy a shirt you didn't like? Why in the world would you go to a law school you don't like? See above for the actual likelihood of transferring (I acknowledge it can be done, but every single piece of literature I've read written by someone on the other side of law school says it happens a whole lot less than people think). Take some time off, get rejuvenated about studying, and come back refreshed with a new drive to destroy the LSAT.
There are literally billions of people not going to law school right now. Its okay to be one of them for a little while longer. If law school is really "your dream" as you state, then you know you need to put the work in to make it happen.
I work full time, am running a national program, and volunteer on the side. Studying while doing this is HARD, I feel you! I get it!
But also, you've gotta. You gotta retake, and you know this. You're asking this question knowing this. If you're already putting in 20 hours a week, you're doing better than I can. Take those 20 hours and make them a really smart 20 hours of work. If you can't increase hours, increase the efficiency with which you operate during those hours. I'm a fan of the Pomodoro technique to keep myself focused during my 'on' time. Blind review each PT you do. Don't just spin your wheels and say you're dreaming of a better score.
The number of hours you can work here isn't an excuse to not retake the test. The amount of effort to focus and work during those 20 hours is hard, but the payoff will be an acceptance to a school that doesn't leave you posting on this forum next year asking if you should spend a huge amount of money on something that doesn't bring you excitement or joy or a feeling of accomplishment. You owe it to yourself to retake, reapply, and go somewhere that makes you feel gratified.
Transferring is always a bad plan. That's not to say that you should never transfer just that it never really helps where it matters in your planning.
The reason you go to a top school is to defray risk. You are less likely to end up without a job at one of these schools.
So the main disadvantage of lower ranked schools isn't that they are bad if you are at the top of the class, but that if you are at the bottom of the class that you may end up without a job.
You can only transfer if you do well. So considering transferring starting out doesn't really change anything. At the tip top of the class you'll be fine regardless of whether you transfer, but at the bottom you are in the same spot with a bunch of debt, a risk of having no job to pay it off, and finally no chance at transferring.
You see i never said I would outshine my peers. what I said was that I can do well in law school is because within the law school frame I know the path I want to take and belieive it or not I dont want to go to a top tier school. I want to stay in New York and attend CUNY LAW which is the city university law school for the sheer fact that it costs a fraction of others.
You see law school dont make you, they just provide you opportunities but what you make of it is up to you. some of us are driven by money others by a desire to help, which fits best with my goals and with what I seek to do. I am not a "rat race" kinda guy. I would like to explore a PHD in law further down. Im a bit older now. I already have worked the 15 hour a day shifts to drive expensive cars, I already made some money, but what I really like to do is study.
I really dont think the LSAT is the clear indicator of who is or will be a good lawyer. being a lawyer is something that must be "in" you. MANY who went to the likes of HARVARD today say they HATE the profession. I know one and he tried talking me out of going that path.
Anyway I know who I am and what I know and dont know. I am here because I want to make a meaningful contribution to society. what we learn in law school is how to be a good researcher and where to find information. I dont expect to a lawyer once I graduate. That should take some time before I earn that respect from my peers.
I am hunmble. but know this, if you see me in a courtroom it wont matter where you studied. I will come rolling down the isle like a steamroller.....then we will see......(KKKK)
hahahahaha!!!! just kidding amigos!
Hating being an attorney doesnt mean you're a bad attorney. I know a lot of attorneys that hate to read and they do a great job and make lots of money. Similarly, I know a lot of attorneys who love their work and they do a bad job and are very unsuccesful.
You do in fact have to "outshine your peers" in order to transfer, that's why schools all have like a 1% transfer rate. A lot of people are gunning to transfer and or be the top percent of the class, hence the term gunners.
Why ask about going to a school you don't want to attend if you were accepted(?) into CUNY and that's where you want to go...or if you weren't accepted to CUNY and that's where you want to go then why wouldnt you retake?
If the sole reason you want to go to law school right now is bc you're over the LSAT and dont want to keep studying for it, then you're really not gonna enjoy the amount of studying you'll have to put in for law school.
Transferring would require you to outperform the vast majority of your peers though. Usually one would have to be within top 10% at the very least, I believe.
your transfer rate is not right.many people transfer. A professor of law from Brooklyn Law school told me that the number is quite high. your argument that people who hate their job do a good job is just bizzare. who the hell want an attorney who hates his or her work? makes no sense. i wonder who are the attorneys you claim you know. how do you know they are unsuccessful? did they tell you? I doubt it. my friend studying for the LSAT and studying for law school are not the same.
Please just retake. Much better option than trying to transfer.
A professor of law from Brooklyn Law did well in law school so the transfer rate probably would seem good to him.
Of course people can hate their job and do a good job. Yes I would still hire them not that I would know that they hated their job.
Of course studying for law school and the LSAT aren't the same. You don't get a second chance at law school. You also don't get to study for as many months as it takes. You get one shot and a semester to study before the most important grades of your life. Of course depending on how you do on the LSAT that law school experience which can't be predicted needs to go different degrees of good to get you a job or let you transfer where you want or whatever.
I very much appreciate your dilemna and your reaching out about it. Be encouraged that you are not alone. A lot of us are in the same boat like you, and I am personally encouraged, myself, to hear the community's supportive and constructive responses to your question and concerns. I must agree whole-heartedly. What's a few more months to do a retake? You don't want to regret it if you don't retake and if it's your life long dream, as it is mine, then you shouldn't settle for less. The LSAT is too important a test to not give it the respect and time that it deserves. I so appreciate how JY and other 7 Sages have emphasized that a year's time of focused study is really what it takes to achieve mastery. It makes me feel less "stupid" (for lack of a better word) after having wasted resources and time on so many other prep courses that weren't right for me. Sure, I could have given up but with 7 Sage, I have renewed hope. With proper explanations, I tend to get stuff and believe you me, NO ONE can break down stuff like JY! Not only did he attend Harvard Law, but no one else has the energy that he does to break down stuff the way he does! With 7 Sage, I feel I now have an excellent chance to beat the LSAT. I don't post much but your question inspired me so much to start giving back to the community with supporting words as others have unwittingly done for me. Good luck to you whatever you decide!
Just look at the transfer rates for schools. Some/most schools have three people transfer a year out of 200 students.
I didn’t say that people who hate their job do a good job. I said some people hate their job and still do a good job. Jobs are just jobs for most people, not their passion projects. They’re jobs, not hobbies. There is no way for one to tell if you dislike aspects of your job at an interview and even if you do blatantly hate your job it doesn’t matter if you have a proven track record of doing well.
You’re not in touch with the working world if you think that loving your job is a necessary condition of doing well at your job.
I know those people are not successful because I worked at their firms and I cut their paychecks and I saw them struggling at work, was told by management about their struggles, and knew them very closely and thus firsthand heard of their lack of success and their love for their job despite their struggles.
Yeah you’re right, studying for the LSAT is much easier than studying for law school. Law school is a full time job, you don’t get any retakes, and you can’t just decide to take a break bc you feel burnt out.
Sounds like you really are not sure. If you want to go the PhD route, go the PhD route. If you want to go the JD route, go the JD route. Unless you're applying to combined programs that is...
Humility will also help in the long run. Many things in life (including grades in law school) are distributed according to a bell curve meaning most will fall within the middle range and very few will do exceptionally well/poorly. Generally, people don't go to law school with the intention of fucking up grades so that should give you an idea of how difficult it is to do well so I am not exactly sure how you are so certain. Everyone thinks they will do well. The reality is that that just does not happen.