ED and retake?

Tatyana L.

Can I apply ED with a current LSAT score, and then retake in November and apply with a new, potentially improved score?

I’ve been crunching the numbers and my chances of getting ED into the school of my choice (one of the UCs) is 23% with the LSAT score I have now. If I retake and apply in December, I have to improve by 3 points to get back to that likelihood, and by 7 points to even get to a 50/50 shot of acceptance. But the average improvement seen for retakes at my level (mid 160s) is only 2 points. Doesn’t seem like my chances of improving things are good. But I really really want to get a 170, or at least get a chance to go at it again.

btownsquee

I just called a school that I wanted to apply ED to. They said as long as I was registered for a future take, they wouldn't look at my application. They would rather evaluate my application holistically than piece-meal it together.

Ohnoeshalpme

This is gonna be a long cycle, I am guessing that ED applicants will have an especially tough time this cycle. You're most likely better off retaking the LSAT and applying at above median.

Also, if you are 7 points below median, 100% do not apply ED this cycle. You will be rejected.

Tatyana L.

@Ohnoeshalpme said:
You're most likely better off retaking the LSAT and applying at above median.

Also, if you are 7 points below median, 100% do not apply ED this cycle. You will be rejected.

I’m actually right at 75% for LSAT score. I’m just that low of gpa that even an LSAT that high doesn’t guarantee success.

Ohnoeshalpme

@"Tatyana L." said:

@Ohnoeshalpme said:
You're most likely better off retaking the LSAT and applying at above median.

Also, if you are 7 points below median, 100% do not apply ED this cycle. You will be rejected.

I’m actually right at 75% for LSAT score. I’m just that low of gpa that even an LSAT that high doesn’t guarantee success.

Why do you say that you need to increase your LSAT by 7 points then? Usually a score 1-2 points above 75th is just as good, as schools are only trying to raise their 25th, 50th and 75th by having people above each mark. As there is nothing you can do about your GPA, you're better off retaking, shooting for a 2+ point increase and trying your luck with an above 75th percentile score. Despite that increase, you still probably won't see much higher than a 25% chance of acceptance.

_oshun1_

For some schools, the November lsat is the latest test with which you can apply ED. Make sure to notify the school and ask them to put your app on hold until you take November. Although, I’m not sure why you would retake if you’re at the 75th, nor why you would apply ED. Retaking the lsat to hit 99th for a potential scholarship boost, doesn’t work when you apply ED. You could easily end up with a $0 scholarship, unless ED comes with a scholarship. EDs that come with scholarships are highly competitive, ie one admissions person I spoke with let me know that their ED (which comes with scholarship) had a 10% acceptance rate, with a majority being top scorers/top gpa.

Tatyana L.

7Sage has a calculator based on last year’s cycle of how likely you are to get in based on ED, gpa, lsat and month applied. If I raise my LSAT score by 7 points, my chances go to 50/50. Apparently it’s not as binary as “below/above 75th percentile”. Based on that calculator, I cut my already measly chances in almost half if I wait a month, but don’t actually improve.

_oshun1_

@"Tatyana L." said:
7Sage has a calculator based on last year’s cycle of how likely you are to get in based on ED, gpa, lsat and month applied. If I raise my LSAT score by 7 points, my chances go to 50/50. Apparently it’s not as binary as “below/above 75th percentile”. Based on that calculator, I cut my already measly chances in almost half if I wait a month, but don’t actually improve.

7sage’s calculator is based on MyLSN, self reported numbers. It’s not an exhaustive list of every applicant. It’s good for an approximate measure just to see how similar applicants fared but I wouldn’t rely on it as being entirely predictive

btownsquee

@Ohnoeshalpme said:
This is gonna be a long cycle, I am guessing that ED applicants will have an especially tough time this cycle. You're most likely better off retaking the LSAT and applying at above median.

Also, if you are 7 points below median, 100% do not apply ED this cycle. You will be rejected.

Why do you say that this is going to be a long cycle?

Tatyana L.

@"surfy surf" said:
7sage’s calculator is based on MyLSN, self reported numbers. It’s not an exhaustive list of every applicant. It’s good for an approximate measure just to see how similar applicants fared but I wouldn’t rely on it as being entirely predictive

That’s an excellent point. I went to look at their actual data (through LSAC). My particular combo has 8 people applying and 3 of them accepted. The LSAT range 5 points higher has 4 applying and 1 accepted. Which leads me to conclude that at that extreme level of splitting, it’s all about the softs and the gpa addendum.
So I guess I should stop focusing on the LSAT for now and write a killer excuse for bad grades.
Thanks. That really helped clarify things for me.

_oshun1_

@"Tatyana L." said:

@"surfy surf" said:
7sage’s calculator is based on MyLSN, self reported numbers. It’s not an exhaustive list of every applicant. It’s good for an approximate measure just to see how similar applicants fared but I wouldn’t rely on it as being entirely predictive

That’s an excellent point. I went to look at their actual data (through LSAC). My particular combo has 8 people applying and 3 of them accepted. The LSAT range 5 points higher has 4 applying and 1 accepted. Which leads me to conclude that at that extreme level of splitting, it’s all about the softs and the gpa addendum.
So I guess I should stop focusing on the LSAT for now and write a killer excuse for bad grades.
Thanks. That really helped clarify things for me.

I wouldn’t take 3/8 as meaning you have a 3/8 chance of getting in, it’s hard to imagine that small of a sample size being predictive of anything. If you were to take that as being predictive, a 37% chance is good.

Tatyana L.

I don’t take that to be predictive. The chances of getting in, if calculated only by past results would be worse if I got 5 points higher on the LSAT (1 out of 4). So a sample size of 8 or 4, and totally random outcome seem to indicate that there is simply too few results, and all of it is simply anecdotal. However that fewer people got in with higher LSAT scores, which is counterintuitive, implies that the decision wasn’t made simply based on the LSAT/GPA number. And if all the people in that bracket are outliers, then it’s by far more efficient to focus on the PS, letters of recommendation and the addendum.

Tatyana L.

I emailed her he school, and within 2 hours got a response. They allow it and will consider ED with old score and in case of rejection will consider the new score during a re-review during the normal application cycle.

Ohnoeshalpme

@btownsquee said:

@Ohnoeshalpme said:
This is gonna be a long cycle, I am guessing that ED applicants will have an especially tough time this cycle. You're most likely better off retaking the LSAT and applying at above median.

Also, if you are 7 points below median, 100% do not apply ED this cycle. You will be rejected.

Why do you say that this is going to be a long cycle?

LSAC lifted the 3 takes maximum policy which invited many applicants to retake. On top of this, LSAT scores were unusually high last year, with significant high-scorer growth across the board. Last cycle was a heavily front-loaded cycle and many schools filled up classes too early. As a result, many schools were unable to capitalize on these score increases. Since it is unknown the lasting impact of this growth, schools are going to wait until after the new year (once they have more cycle data) to make final decisions.