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Logical Reasoning Breaking 20Q

Help!! Can't do more than 16 LR Q with 80% accuracy. Tips?? I want to touch 20

Comments

  • PacificoPacifico Alum Inactive ⭐
    8021 karma
    Are you not even finishing the section in time? You really want to shoot to finish your first pass in LR in 30 minutes so you can go back to devote more time to the harder questions. You must spend less time on easy/medium questions and skip the hardest on the first pass and then return to them after you finish.
  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    7965 karma
    OP-- I echo @Pacifico . You are spending WAY too long on individual questions. This test requires the self-discipline to move on as opposed to spinning your wheels.
  • GSU HopefulGSU Hopeful Core
    1644 karma
    @as5324 said:
    I want to touch 20
    You need to work to touch them all. The hardest questions aren't concentrated near the end anymore. If you're not touching them all, then you're not gathering all the low hanging fruit that the test is leaving you.
  • nordeendnordeend Alum Member
    349 karma
    @as5324 do you mean you are only finishing 16 or that after 16 your accuracy drops below 80%?
  • as5324therapyas5324therapy Member
    175 karma
    @nordeend only finishing 16. dont have time to even look at (17-25)
  • cjones76cjones76 Alum Member
    edited November 2015 318 karma
    I had a similar problem. This is what I did to get myself to answer more questions.

    I set small incremental goals each test. So next test try to reach 18/19. Once you reach that try to reach 20/21.

    I calculated how much time that allowed me per question and knew that if I was going over I needed to move on. So, for 18 questions it'd be about 1 min 55 seconds. Then I used a loop timer to plug in that amount of time and periodically look up at my computer to see what loop I should be on and how that measured up to what question number I was at. Therefore, I knew I was spending too much time or if my speed was improving. Allowing myself to visually see where I should be really helped develop a sense of timing. Because prior I was allowing myself spend way to long on easier questions, but wouldn't realize it. This forced me to focus on increasing my speed.

    Obviously, you won't have that benefit during the real test, so once you get to where you want to be or close to it I would stop using the loop timer.

    And to echo what everyone else said, you need to learn how to devote less time easy question and to not spin your wheels on hard questions. When a question is easy don't question it and second guess yourself (real thought process: "that was way too easy, I need to redo that to confirm thats right"). Instead take it and run- move on to the next question. When you can't figure out what a stimulus is telling or can't figure out the answer circle it answer move on. Don't sit there and compare answer choices to each other.

    Increasing speed is also about hounding in fundamentals, so they come more as second nature.

    http://www.online-stopwatch.com/loop-countdown/ <--- loop timer
  • edited November 2015 121 karma
    I recommend trying to do 10 of the first 12 questions in 10 minutes. This means skipping two harder questions if needed. Keeps you moving at first where it easier to waste time spinning your wheels. Also read J.Y. (?) article on why you need to skip questions on the LSAT (it is about coconuts). If you aren't skipping questions in your first run through of LR sections, you are doing it wrong unless you are a unicorn (in the words of @nicole.hopkins).

    http://7sage.com/lesson/why-you-must-skip-questions-on-the-lsat/
  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    7965 karma
    @cjones76 said:
    I set small incremental goals each test. So next test try to reach 18/19. Once you reach that try to reach 20/21.

    I calculated how much time that allowed me per question and knew that if I was going over I needed to move on. So, for 18 questions it'd be about 1 min 55 seconds. Then I used a loop timer to plug in that amount of time and periodically look up at my computer to see what loop I should be on and how that measured up to what question number I was at. Therefore, I knew I was spending too much time or if my speed was improving. Allowing myself to visually see where I should be really helped develop a sense of timing. Because prior I was allowing myself spend way to long on easier questions, but wouldn't realize it. This forced me to focus on increasing my speed.
    Wow, this is brilliant.
  • DumbHollywoodActorDumbHollywoodActor Alum Inactive ⭐
    7468 karma
    You want to “touch” all of them. The question is for how long. Develop a feeling of what 1:20 feels like. Ideally, no one question should ever get more than that amount of time on your first go around. You can also save some time in the bank by giving yourself no more than a minute (maybe even 0:45) on Main Point, Argument Part, and Flaw questions. The truth is you should have a VERY good idea of the answer after you’ve read the stimulus of these type of questions. If you don’t, MOVE ON! Chances are, you’re not going to be able to “figure it out” under test conditions. Eliminate the knucklehead answers, take a guess, circle the question, and move on. If you have more time at the end, you can go back. Many times, you’re able to see the gap/flaw/explanation of the stimulus on that second go-around.
  • deleted accountdeleted account Free Trial Member
    393 karma
    @as5324

    I have a theory for people who can't go quickly on LR. I think that people give too much respect to the answer choices.

    Just for perspective on my technique, on the October test I got 3 LR sections. I finished the three sections with 5, 10, and 15 minutes remaining (not counting the time I used to go back and recheck what I had circled). I had -1/-2 on the two real sections. Can't match the time to number wrong, but that's pretty typical for my preptests.

    Anyway, I think that people who don't move that fast give too much respect to the answer choices. I suspect that as you go through the answer choices, you may be trying to make them work instead of realizing that they are almost certainly (80% chance) totally wrong.

    Here's how I approach it. First I read the argument as many times as I need to until I feel it click in my head. This may be 2, 3, or even 4 times. If I get to that many times, I will probably take a break and meditate for 10 seconds. Typically it's 2 times and roughly 20 seconds here.

    Then I approach the answer choices, and I totally rip through them. I will read as little as I need to to eliminate it mercilessly. I semi-frequently eliminate all 5 choices (maybe 5 times/test) but will eliminate it for any reason. Typically first pass is 5-10 seconds/answer and second pass, if necessary (typically not) is 20 seconds/answer, as I have to compare them.

    For example:
    Argument: A controlled experiment found blah blah blah stone is good for trees blah blah
    Question: Most Strongly supported
    Answers:
    a) Many experiments say blah blah blah
    b) bushes like nice dirt

    I eliminate answer (a) on the first pass the instant that I read "many experiments" because the passage said "_a_ experiment." Doesn't matter what the rest of the answer choice says so I don't bother reading it. I eliminate answer choice (b) as soon as I read the word "bushes" simply because a bush may not be a tree. If nothing else works for me I can come back, but otherwise it's imperfect.

    Then I circle whatever is remaining as long as it works in my head.

    So I think you may need to give less respect to the answer choices and, mostly importantly of all, ensure that you 100% understand the argument prior to touching the answers. Otherwise you could easily be spending 30 seconds/answer comparing it to an argument that may not be fully embedded in your head.

    For the record, this is completely different from how I approach RC (typically only have 2-3 minutes left) and LG (typically have 1 minutes left).
  • 121 karma
    @josephellengar Wow. Great advice. I'm going to try implementing that strategy a bit more. I often have 1 maybe 2 Q's at the end that are long PR questions I skipped but I do often catch myself hitting the answer choices without being very sure about what I just read and wasting way to much time per answer choice. It's better to spend 1 minute per stimulus and 10 seconds per answer than it is t spend 30 seconds on the stimulus and 30 seconds on each answer choice.
  • 121 karma
    @josephellengar DUDE! I tried you strategy (more like mindset) today on a PT and I saw great results. Went -2 and -3 in LR from about -5/-6 on average before. I should note that the -5/-6 was on newer PTs (51, 52, & 70) and this was was on a older one (40) but I have to say it is a good way to approach the these sections. Thanks again.
  • deleted accountdeleted account Free Trial Member
    393 karma
    @markariangeorge: Glad to hear! No problem! Sorry I didn't get back sooner -- just finishing off my apps :)
  • nicole.hopkinsnicole.hopkins Inactive Sage Inactive ⭐
    7965 karma
    @josephellengar said:
    So I think you may need to give less respect to the answer choices and, mostly importantly of all, ensure that you 100% understand the argument prior to touching the answers. Otherwise you could easily be spending 30 seconds/answer comparing it to an argument that may not be fully embedded in your head.

    @SA135790 now this is what I'm talking about—getting SASSY with the test!

    image
  • joannewujoannewu Member
    53 karma
    @josephellengar said:

    For the record, this is completely different from how I approach RC (typically only have 2-3 minutes left) and LG (typically have 1 minutes left).
    Do you mind sharing how you approach RC? Having 2-3 minutes left to spare would be my DREAM. I run out of time in RC sections with 4-5 questions unanswered almost without fail.
  • deleted accountdeleted account Free Trial Member
    393 karma
    @joannewu:

    Love to share, and I may disappoint, haha, because I don't really know. In a class I instruct someone asked me this question the other day and I've been having trouble creating a coherent answer.

    More I have a list of tips:

    1) I really really make sure I get the passage. In the same way that I can tell if I didn't get a LR passage, and need to reread it, I can feel that in RC. If I don't get a paragraph I reread. I can always zoom through the questions and probably have a decent idea of the answer choice anyway, so I don't mind wasting 5+ minutes per passage.

    2) Once the passage is locked into my mind, I attack the questions similarly to how I attack LR. I eliminate the wrong stuff mercilessly, but also realize that RC is subtler. It doesn't repeat as much and on almost every question there are at least 2 that are somewhat plausible, which is very different from LR, where on most questions only 1 is even plausible at all. I tend to not refer back to the passage because of my upfront work, although I will. If I do, I read roughly 3 lines ahead/behind. Typically the answer matters more on the _context_ of where you referred than what it actually said.

    Example:

    On a question that asks what "decent idea" meant in my tip 1 above (most strongly supported) a correct answer is far more likely to be about rereading than about what "decent idea" means. The LSAT tries to be subtle, in that way, but it's easy to see through

    3) Realize that a lot of the test can be about intuition. At least 2 points of my improvement were entirely due to pattern recognition. In the same way that sometimes LR answers "feel" weird, sometimes RC answers aren't the type of answer that LSAC has given in the past. Stuck between 2 answer choices, I will almost always choose that one that feels more LSAT-y to me.

    (This certainly works on LR, and even on LG!!! On the Oct test I missed a full rule in the third game! I still got all of the questions right because I could feel that the game relied mostly on two letters and I had a halfway decent idea of the dynamics between those letters without the rule I needed, and I had an idea of the type of answers that LSAC goes for, so I guessed correctly five times. I remember thinking on one question "it just doesn't feel right that this game board would be tested on this question, but the rules allow it, right?" Of course, I also dreaded my score for a full month once I realized I had ^$^#*@# MISSED A RULE)

    4) For studying: read more stuff. I read dense stuff for several months to get my mind into the correct frame. This was stuff like The Economist, The Origin of Species, various scientific papers, philosophy etc. I just put it on my phone and read at the bus stop, and tried to analyze it.

    Honestly, other than that, I've got no real advice. RC is hard. Took me a very long time to improve.
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