It’s true that you have to report your parents’ information, but when you look at HYS’s need-based aid, there’s some sort of rebalancing that goes on if you’re 25-29... you yourself become responsible for an increasing percentage of tuition, fin-aid-wise. If you’re in your 30s or beyond, I don’t think you need to report your parents’ income. Watch the ‘application overview’ video here: http://hls.harvard.edu/dept/sfs/video-library/

This sounds like it could make for a good PS. Why are you hesitant?

I took the GRE about 6 years ago, and here’s my thoughts re: difficulty, pros/cons.

The GRE is similar to but more difficult than the SAT, but only because the GRE is digital and recalculates based on how well you do on your first sections. If you ace the first English and math sections, you’ll receive very difficult second English and math sections. If you get this very hard second English section, it’s comparable to a hard LSAT RC section—not a walk in the park by any means. The GRE’s all on computer, and you can sign up to take it almost any time you want. You go in, you’re the only one taking the GRE usually, you leave your stuff in a locker, and you sit at a computer station with other people taking other sorts of tests in the same room. You don’t all start at the same time; you don’t all finish at the same time. The LSAT writing process is so highly ritualized that it’s very stressful... the GRE lacks all of that pomp and show.

The GRE is interesting because almost all graduate students end up taking it... math or physics PhDs, anthropology MAs, poetry MFAs, etc. So a lot of people tend to score highly in one section, particularly math since there are mathematicians taking a math test that doesn’t even have calculus on it.

Anecdotally, without studying, I was in the 90-92nd percentile on the GRE, and my LSAT diagnostic was 85th-ish percentile. I did well on the SAT, and I’m slightly better at math than RC, so maybe the GRE just plays to my strengths more than the LSAT.

Part of the difficulty of the LSAT for me is the sustained level of difficulty/intensity throughout the test. The first two sections on the GRE are only moderately difficult, and then if things are going well, you’ll get two actually hard sections. Alternatively, if things aren’t going well, you’ll get two soft-ball sections, realize you bombed the first two, cancel your score, and get on with your day. The LSAT is a whole other animal... you have no idea what section’s coming when, and it could all potentially be very hard. Then, you’re left with thoughts of canceling, speculation on the curve, etc., for weeks, whereas you get your GRE score before you leave the test site.

What’s something that has surprised you about your 1L year so far?

Schools accepting the GRE worry me because I feel like they won’t go through the trouble of accepting GRE scores and then not accept any of these new applicants.... which makes the total number of seats available for LSAT takers smaller, assuming their overall class sizes don’t increase... which means they won’t need to accept some people with below median LSAT numbers they would have overwise accepted to fill their class... which leads to an inflated LSAT median for this cycle.

This, of course, assumes there are a considerable number of people who will take the GRE, realize they can apply to law school, apply, and actually accept a seat. I’m pretty skeptical that these people exist in large numbers.

I think that your being homeschooled contributes to a school’s diversity (so long as the prompt doesn’t specifically ask for socio-economic disadvantage). Fair game for a diversity statement.

However, the question I would ask is this: does this anecdote about high school & golf add to your application? Does it reveal something to the ad com about yourself that is not otherwise present in your application? The rule of thumb seems to be not to write a diversity statement just because you can... only write one if it adds quality.

I don’t know if this is entirely accurate. I concede that to some extent, it’s a numbers game. However, if you’re on the bubble, they absolutely will look at an MIT engineering GPA differently from a community college basketweaving GPA. You have to be on the bubble, i.e., have reasonable numbers, but soft factors are factors. They’re soft, but they still come into play when your numbers leave you maybe in/maybe out.

I went to the Duke/Stanford/Cornell deans’ panel in NYC, and someone asked about having a science background. The admissions dean from Duke literally cut him off and said that it was great to have a science background and if you have a science background, “we’re looking for you” when he reads apps.

It was listed after the June scores came out. It wasn't listed at first.

Here’s one tip for test day anxiety that helped me:

You know that moment at the beginning of each section where the proctor says, “Begin,” and everyone frantically flips the page? You start holding your breath, trying to read faster, trying not to think about the last section, saying to yourself, “Focus!!” Instead, when you flip the page, pause. Watch everyone else panic for just a second. They’re about to make stupid mistakes because they’re panicking. But you’ve got this. Take a deep breath, and begin. The 2 seconds, or even 5 seconds, you spend doing this at the beginning of each section will pay off in dividends over the next 35 minutes because you took the time to correct your mindset before you began to fall into the rabbit hole of anxiety and panic.

Anecdotally, I’ve heard of GPA addendums coming up in interviews. If you submit a GPA addendum and claim that your grades will be better in law school, be prepared to defend that assertion with some concrete reasons or, if applicable, actions you’ve taken since then. A friend listed depression as a reason his/her grades fell one semester, and his/her interviewer at a T14 school asked about it, first question: What’s changed? How can you be sure this won’t happen again? BTW, he/she was accepted to said school :)

If you look at 509 reports, there are some students' GPAs that are not factored into a school's GPA medians. Take a look at Harvard's 509 -- http://hls.harvard.edu/content/uploads/2016/12/2016-Standard-509-Information-Report.pdf -- last year, there were 26 not included. I had always assumed those were international students, but maybe some are from P/F schools.

I think a lot of the “T-14 or bust” mentality comes from an overall decline in the legal market since the generation before ours. When my parents went to school, going to law school—any law school—was considered a golden ticket to the middle class. It’s no longer a golden ticket... like others have said in this thread, law degrees are expensive and regionalized and some markets are oversaturated.

If you want a slightly depressing read, check out this blog https://www.huffingtonpost.com/tucker-max/law-school_b_2713943.html and this Reddit post https://www.reddit.com/r/lawschooladmissions/comments/4f9ve4/how_to_calculate_whether_school_x_is_worth_the/

One of my recommenders sent these to me. He said if none of this gives you pause, apply to law school.

Agree 100% with @.

I tuned in for the one earlier this week, and all you missed was a powerpoint slide show. Q&A was helpful since I had a specific question about the app.

It’s worth noting that these numbers are for the Class of 2019... Reddit is compiling numbers for the Class of 2020 as they’re published https://www.reddit.com/r/lawschooladmissions/comments/6u4ceb/class_of_2020_medians/

One little spoken of resource that’s really helped me is the Thinking LSAT podcast. It’s two LSAT private tutors talking about the test and their students’ problems, as well as answering listeners’ questions. Their perspective is a bit different than 7sage’s, which I find balances my approach to the test. And, it’s free + you can listen to it at work or on the go :)

@, where do you think you went wrong on the Sept test? Was it test day nerves? Anything atypical during the exam? Bubbling mistake? Skipping more questions than usual? If you can find anywhere that you’ve left obvious points on the table, I’d say retake in December. If you can pinpoint exactly what you need to focus your studies on for the next two months, retake in December.

However, if you simply need to master more of the material, a +7 to +11 score increase would be a remarkable feat in a mere two months’ time. I think now’s the time for brutal honesty with yourself. Since there’s no 3 test limit, I guess there’s no downside to taking the December test besides the money spent. But, are you prepared to take it a third time if you don’t see the score you want in December?

So, definitely retake. Maybe in December. Figure out what went wrong and if you can fix it in two months.

@ Congratulations!!! You deserve it :smiley: You were a great asset on our BR calls.

@ Heya, fellow Greenpointer! PM me if you want to get coffee (Sweetleaf?) or talk about the test! I just retook in Sept and am much happier with my score... I’m not sure yet if I’ll retake in December. An extra point’s always tempting!

I think unemployment as a topic could go either way. Did you face true adversity during your time unemployed? Or did you face a series of inconveniences? If it’s the latter case, the adcom might see the essay as immature or lacking perspective. If you demonstrate real adversity, however, I think it could be successful!

I think “quiet” personal statements can be just as successful as really “flashy” stories about rescue diving in a hurricane, offering humanitarian aid in a war-torn country, etc. The most important thing is that your PS must be well written. Quiet stories with smaller stakes might be easier to pull off in just a few pages. Take heart!

Assuming you are a typical applicant, you’ll pay for 2 LSATs, CAS, and 10 apps. That totals $1020 paid to LSAC.

I wonder if they’ll see a drop in registrations for upcoming test dates. $190 seems prohibitively expensive... Then again, with unlimited takes, total registrations may increase.

IMO, If the PS is limited to 2 pages, it’d be a bad move to give them 2 pages plus a link to a 4 page article. The writing should stand alone. You could mention there being a NYT article and leave it up to them to google it, but I don’t think it’s worth the page space.

The bottom line is that they have a lot to read! Be kind to your admissions readers. Brevity and strong writing will go a long way.

The problem with anecdotal answers like “Kamala Harris went to Hastings” is that sure, we all can name one person who went to Hastings. Maybe some people can name 2 or 3. But Hasting’s IL class size is 348. What happened to the other 347?

I’m sure some of them passed the bar and are happily practicing law and they don’t regret attending Hastings at all. But that’s not true for everyone. Check out their 509 disclosure, and ask yourself, are you Kamala Harris? If not, her case probably doesn’t apply to you.

(Nothing against Hastings—just an example of anecdotal claims!)

For LG, no. Once you see the right answer, you don’t need to read the rest. For example, “Which of the following could be true?” means that only one AC could be true. Once you find an AC that could be true, pick it and don’t read the rest. There’s only one—have confidence in your diagram.

For LR, no and yes. Most questions I can prephrase strongly; others, I can’t, or for whatever reason, my prephrase isn’t in the list of ACs. If I’m struggling, I’ll aggressively eliminate obviously wrong answers and then decide between the final two.

For RC, it also depends. For a main point question, I’ll read at least the beginning of all the ACs. For a recall question, once I see something that was plainly stated in the text, there’s no point in reading the other ACs.

I think, in general, there’s a huge benefit to not reading all the ACs and, in particular, to not reading entire ACs once things have gone awry. For example, if you’re looking at a SA question in LR and there’s no prescriptive language in the stimulus, the instant you see the word “should” in an AC, you should stop reading the AC. It’s already wrong, and nothing can save it. Skipping half sentences does add up to extra time... In a 25 question LR section, there are 25 stimuli, 100 wrong answers, and 25 right answers. Spend as little time as possible handling the 100 wrong answers.

IMO the less of the test you read (and the fewer LG ACs you test on your diagram), the faster you can complete sections. The test parts you NEED to read to score 170+ are the passages, game set ups, and LR stimuli... the test parts you don’t need to read are the wrong ACs. In blind review, be sure you can eliminate every single wrong AC, but don’t get in the habit of doing this in PTs... it’s a hard habit to break once you set it! (Speaking from experience!)

News is written in a different format than your typical RC passage. The structure of a news article is typically (at the top of the article) what’s new/most interesting -> (at the bottom of the article) what’s least interesting. RC passages on the LSAT are often hard because they bury the lead or make the author’s opinion subtle.

I would buy an old edition of a law textbook (maybe Law & Philosophy?) for cheap on Amazon and read it if you’re looking to do something extra. It’s dense, and you might learn a bit of context for the law passages in RC. Or, do what I do: teach SAT reading comp :)

FWIW - After I took the June LSAT last year, I got a ton of emails telling me that “there were still spots left” for the fall starting class and that I should get in touch if interested. Even at some high ranking schools, like UCLA. I’m sure a lot of schools will consider a high scoring February LSAT taker.