Foolproofing

nathanieljschwartz

Hi, i was wondering if, after watching the video explanation, you still finish after the suggested amount of time should one try again the same day? Or wait till another day?

P.s. i fool proof by trying the game and then watching JY and then attempting it again right after. And then again the next day and then the next week

AllezAllez21

I think the standard recommendation is to do it again until you're under time.

Personally, I don't. I like to wait because I feel it challenges me a bit more to really work through the inferences instead of regurgitating them.

nathanieljschwartz

Thanks, yeah i feel that. If JYs inferences are so fresh it doesnt feel like i am actually forcing myself to make my own.

Sami

@nathanieljschwartz said:
Hi, i was wondering if, after watching the video explanation, you still finish after the suggested amount of time should one try again the same day? Or wait till another day?

P.s. i fool proof by trying the game and then watching JY and then attempting it again right after. And then again the next day and then the next week

I do it the same day until I can get it under time, then I schedule it for next day and then next week.

It definitely feels like your are regurgitating inferences. Just make sure you are being honest about how you arrive at the answer. Learning these inferences is fine as well as good because knowing these inferences is what gives us speed in a similar game.

Freddy_D

Your method sounds similar to the Pacifico method. I also repeat until the inferences become automatic. I blacked-out yesterday and when I came to I had finished a section (PT9) -0 in 22 minutes. Fool proofing is magical!

Heart Shaped Box

As long as you keep returning to the games systematically, the system/amount of wait in between could be rather flexible depending your own situation and comfort level. At the beginning of fool proof tho, I would suggest do it the same day immediately and multiple times then the day after, cuz your goal at that stage is to develop muscle memory and memorization of inferences, familiarity of LG in general. Once you get it at/around suggested time, that's where you could be more flexible. Try to keep the timing at least a minute or two "under" the suggested time during fool proof period (with a few exceptions of J.Y. being on steroid), and make a list of the games/sections gives you trouble the most put them in a separate folder giving some special attention. e.g. The sections I consistently finish around 21 to 25 mins, those are in my green folder (longer wait). The ones 28 mins above, red folder. The rest in yellow folder just routinely going through. Of course, this is just my own personal preference on the timing mark, feel free to develop your own. The longest wait I have is about 3 months for the ones in green folder, and if I could still get it down within the margin of error one minute ish after 3 months not doing them, then I know they are/should be good at least for another 3 months, hence better distribute my time on others and not having to worry about everything else.

nathanieljschwartz

Is it normal that i suck at games? I just started foolproofing

AllezAllez21

@nathanieljschwartz

Yes, don't get discouraged. When I started out fool proofing it would routinely take me 15 to 20 minutes to complete each game. It took another 3-5 weeks to feel like I was surviving the games, and no until probably about 8-10 weeks in that I really felt mastery.

It's a process, you've just got to get in and get started. The key is repetition.

Heart Shaped Box

I'll just put it this way; it's been a year since I started at the games. True, I've made tremendous progress, but to this day, I don't dare to claim any kind of mastery in LG or any section on the LSAT for that matter. I'm one of the slowest ppl you can meet out there, and if I can do it, you can too, but much better.

nathanieljschwartz

I was wondering how long you guys sit there trying a game. Sometimes i find that i will be sitting with a game for 20 minutes and i have absolutely no idea how to go about solving it. Should i just try the questions? Or should i just watch JYs video? Further, should i watch the complete video? Or should i just watch enough to were i think i can have a chance at figuring out the rest?

Alex

@nathanieljschwartz said:
I was wondering how long you guys sit there trying a game. Sometimes i find that i will be sitting with a game for 20 minutes and i have absolutely no idea how to go about solving it. Should i just try the questions? Or should i just watch JYs video? Further, should i watch the complete video? Or should i just watch enough to were i think i can have a chance at figuring out the rest?

I'll answer both questions for what I do:

I do the game first, watch the video, repeat game. then depending on where I'm at probably do the game again later or tomorrow. If I feel like I'm still not getting it, I'll do more copies and keep watching the video until I get it. I like @Pacifico's method, but sometimes some games take me hours of work and 10-20 copies.

Great question: How long to sit there trying a game before you should just give in and watch the damn video. I'll be honest because sometimes I don't know... I guess it depends on how close I am to figuring out whatever the hell the issue is. Sometimes I see a game and I'm just like WHAT!? I have absolutely no god's honest idea where to even ....... I'm just lost. I'll re-read the stim again, give myself a few minutes to mess around with scenarios, but ultimately, if within 3-5 minutes I'm still jus stuck, I cut my losses and watch the video. I've been stuck there for 20 minutes and sometimes eventually I'll get part of it, but that's more rare and usually I just waste time. Better to get on to the next one, at least in my opinion.

Now for those tricky ones where you can at least begin diagramming. Give them some time. Maybe ~20 minutes before you watch the video. See if you can look at the games and deduce some sort of strategy or ordering you are missing.

Hope this helps!

AllezAllez21

@nathanieljschwartz

I set a 30 minute limit for myself initially. Worst case, you just start trying out hypotheticals and brute forcing the game and maybe it gives you some insight. If I still don't have it after 30 minutes then I stop and watch the video. That's okay. Part of the goal of fool proofing is to just literally memorize set ups and inferences--they don't all have to come from your own intuition.

Alex

@AllezAllez21 said:
@nathanieljschwartz

I set a 30 minute limit for myself initially. Worst case, you just start trying out hypotheticals and brute forcing the game and maybe it gives you some insight. If I still don't have it after 30 minutes then I stop and watch the video. That's okay. Part of the goal of fool proofing is to just literally memorize set ups and inferences--they don't all have to come from your own intuition.

Great point and exactly how I see it. When I was first learning games a lot of times I would just watch JY's free games on YouTube without really ever trying. Kind of using it like a free lesson. Eventually I signed up within about a week, but I remember it working!