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I've been really delaying making this thread, partially in hopes that I would start hitting the scores I need to soon, and wouldn't need to basically rant.
I started studying in May, finished the core curriculum + all Cambridge packets in 2months, and July 8th I started doing Practice Tests. I've done 8 in total, I do 3 a week, M, W, and F, mainly in accordance with my local university library's schedule. I blind review the lsats the entire day after, so on Tuesdays, and Thursday, and on the weekends I take it a little easier and blind review half day on Sat and Sun. I should mention that my BR scores are never much higher, they're always around 161, which worries me as time is clearly not the problem. I generally catch my silly mistakes in BR, but reading LR I almost always just go with my original answers. :/
I never took a diagnostic as I didn't want to discourage myself by getting a low score, and also didn't want to do LG without having proper diagramming skills. If I had to guess, I would say it would be pretty low, probably 140s, but I guess I'll never know.
Unlike most of the people on 7Sage, I'm from Canada, and here all you need to get into a vast majority of the schools, even some of the best ones is an LSAT score of 160+, assuming you have a stellar GPA, which I'm happy to say I have. For my particular school of choice, a 162 on the LSAT would guarantee me a spot according to the index score used for this year, and 160 would most likely get me in off the waiting list.
Now getting to the rant part, I'm stuck in a slump. My last 5 LSAT scores have been: 159, 157, 156, 158, and today was 157. The corresponding raw scores were 74, 69, 71, 70, and 73.
According to the analytics I have the most difficulty with Flaw/Descriptive weakening questions, and Law passages (the irony :L).
LG is my strongest section, I usually go -3 and it's usually due to either not having enough time or misreading some rules. RC is weird for me, there are days like today, where I went 20/26, and others where I go 18/28. LR is another weird one, it's all over the place. Average is 66%, usually 17/25, but some days I go 20/25, and today oddly enough I went 19/25, and 15/26.
I've been reading the Trainer, and am on Chapter 10, but stopped after I started taking PTs, will get back to it asap, and try to make sure I read one chapter everyday.
So sorry for this loooooooong background story, but I need help getting out of this slump and I'm so sick of coming home and marking my LSATs only to find out I keep getting 157ish. I'm hoping maybe as long as I keep at it, I'll eventually just increase my score, but I keep thinking like no matter what I do I always end up at the same score. Like days where I rock LG and RC, I mess up LR, and other days I rock LR and mess up RC.
Is there any other material I should get, like potentially read through the Manhattan LR, or go back and review 7Sage core lessons?
By Oct I need to get 160+, and I would even be happy with literally just getting 160, but I'm worried as people say the later tests are even harder, and if I'm scoring 157 on these earlier, apparently easier tests, I don't want to know what will happen later on. Which is why I think I'm going to start jumping around, I've done PTs 39-46 so far, and I think I should do 60s next week?
Anyway, thanks for reading, and I apologize again for making this exceptionally long.
* Oh and regarding time, I generally haven't had a problem with not finishing sections on time, that being said I don't have extra but I somehow always seem to just finish before time runs out, don't get any time leftover to go back to any questions, but when I go through questions I usually pick one without the intention of having to come back.
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46 comments
I wrote them out completely blind. Then, after I entered everything into the analytics, I added an addendum either to questions I got wrong, correctly explaining why my reasoning was wrong, or to questions I got right but for the wrong reasons.
Be ready for it to take forever, but it's very helpful. I have yet to blind review under 170 because of that process.
Awesome advice! Quick clarification - did you type it out during BR and then check your reasoning for each problem right then or do it after you had BR'd the entire test and checked your reasoning on any low, high and very high priority questions from the LSAT analytics? I am on my 4th PT, BR score 161, and making no improvement (which is to be expected at this point in the game). I would like to take a similar approach that you did with writing out my explanations, and want to figure out how best to do it so that I make sure I am making the most out of the process.
This was the first time I pushed myself to go faster, I usually just read through at a normal pace and finish just in time. I just found it interesting that there was no score difference when I pushed myself or when I didn't. And I just BRed the test this weekend and every question I got was literally one of those trap questions, where there was one popular wrong answer choice, and then a subtle right answer. According to the analytics as well, most people would mess up and pick the wrong answer. I'm not justifying anything, but at least now I'm not messing up on easy questions, so I can hone down to these tougher questions.
I made a document with all the questions I've gotten wrong from the last 10 PTs, and will keep drilling them and adding to it as I do more PTs!
Thanks for the advice! My goal is actually only 160, anything above that would just be for my own esteem rather than required for the schools I'm trying to get into. I'm now finally PTing at 160s, but I need to get higher in case I drop points on actual test day.
@4985 It seems like you should take a deep breath. You're in the high 150's and you want ~165, around 8 more questions per test. As with anything in life, your goals should be big but your vision of progress should be incremental. Aim for the best score you can possibly get every time with the understanding that you'll only be able to chip away slowly at that deficit.
Follow everyone's advice here with BR. It's tempting to gloss over it because you may feel better off taking another test, but that's not the case.
Specifically for LR, one thing I've been doing that I find immensely helpful is to look at the wrong answers for questions (both easy and difficult) and think about what would need to change about that answer to make it correct. If an answer to a parallel method of reasoning question is incorrect, consider what it is about the wording or relationship between conditions you could change to "fix" it. This is another angle to mastering the questions; if process of elimination allowed you to disqualify a question, think about what it would take to un-eliminate it.
@4985 finishing the test faster doesn't mean you'll get higher scores, and if anything, I would think it would probably end up being detrimental. You don't want to speed through the reading of stimuli to get to the answers. That's wholly counterproductive. Speed is gained by understanding, not a forced read through. And if you routinely miss 13 questions on LR then your understanding is not quite there yet, so speeding through to finish 5 or even 10(!) minutes early isn't going to do the trick (my PT avg is in the high 70s and I've never finished an LR section 10 minutes early).
My advice would be to actually slow down. Accuracy is what's most important, not finishing the test. Would you rather reach question 21 missing only 0-1 on these, and have to guess on the last 4, or would you rather rush through to finish on time if that means missing 7?
Reading the stimulus can absolutely not be rushed. If you aren't evaluating the argument completely and understanding all that it's saying, then you're gonna go into the answer choices without a clear view of what to look for--choices that are designed by super experts that are meant to trip you up.
Work on understanding each question and stimulus on its own terms. Evaluate it and understand it. Only then will it be easier to move through the wrong choices because you'll have a good idea of what you are looking for.
@2543.hopkins thanks, I think it's so much better to hear real stories rather than just people's scores. I read someone's comment that it took them at least 12 to even start to see a difference and I remembered that when I was not seeing a change.10 tests can be really crushing if you don't know it gets better. Especially 10 tests after doing the whole 7sage course. It's hard. I thought I was "pretty smart" but this test really humbled me. I really wanted to be in the 170s, I thought I worked hard enough for it. But when you shoot for perfection and miss, you can still end up in the 96th percentile. Because I noticed some stupid uncommon mistakes I made, I got really close to retaking in October just to accomplish my goal of 170s. Don't lose sight of what your goal really is, I got into my first/only choice 4 weeks before class starts so I guess I will let the 170 go.
@4985
https://www.google.com/calendar/embed?src=uo98fv4muqt7l3t87off6q7960%40group.calendar.google.com&ctz=America/Chicago
Haha alrighty LSAT Doc!
Is there some sort of schedule for future PTs that you will be BRing together? I got PTs 60-75 left to do, and 46-56 which I will most likely not get enough time to complete.
You are AWESOME. Thank you so much for this transparency. Extremely encouraging to myself and others.
I didn't start getting the score I ultimately got on the LSAT until I had take about15 pts. The more the better. There is a pattern and the only way to recognize it is to keep seeing it. Keep going and don't be discouraged. I studied from July-May with 158-162 pts no movement for 10 months, then in May 166+ never dropped again. Nothing felt different but the scores were consistent. I took in June 168. Keep going, you're really close.
It sounds like you're trusting yourself more. That's good. It also sounds like you haven't mastered the traps yet. That comes with practice ... And honestly, the BR calls have helped me do this more than anything. At this point, I'm gonna write you a prescription for BR calls and ask you to check back in on this in a couple weeks.
Rather than making a new discussion I thought it might be easier to just post in this one, but after taking PT 59 today I'm a little idk, I need guidance.
Usually I've been finishing LR right on time, so today I tried to really push myself through the questions. This led me to kinda rapid speed through the questions, and anticipate answers; for the most part I was on a roll. I had 5min to spare the first LR, which has never happened before.
2nd LR was even more insane, I had 10 friggin minutes to spare. So I went back to all my circled questions and kind of sat and pondered them, but didn't end of changing anything, I had a feeling I would not trust my gut and mess up.
Results for LR today were exactly what I always get, -6 first LR, and -7 2nd LR. These scores are basically what I always have been getting on LR for the past like 5-6 PTs, but obviously in those PTs I finish JUST in time.
So now I'm kinda confused. I went into the analytics and it doesn't seem like these LRs are a lot easier than others for this test, so what could be the reason?
haha united all the Canadians indeed <3 I've been waiting for a thread like this!!! I thought I was one of the only Canadians! Thank God I am not!
My goal is University of Toronto, but it still have a long way to go. The avg LSAT score for Uft is 167 (CRAZY). I'm scoring in the low 160s, so hopefully by the time October rolls around I can gain a few more points to reach that pinnacle.
7Sage Party in Victoria! Who's down?
Oh definitely, I think I have to move out of my current town just to keep my sanity.
I'm glad this thread basically united all the Canadians! Haha
I live in Victoria, and if you're looking for a small knit community, you'll certainly enjoy it here. I'll be applying to UVIC as well but will mostly likely choose a school in a city over it (just because I spent too much time here haha).
Let's all go to Victoriaaaaa!
Not really tbh. I'd much rather prefer Victoria, but then again I think UBC and Toronto and both a little too intimidating to me, and even if I got the required LSAT scores to go there, I'd prefer going somewhere with a smaller community.
Are you aiming to go to UBC? It's one of my top choices. I just broke 160 mark yesterday and have been making a slow progress since I started PTing(sigh).. hopefully I will reach 165+ soon!
Oh definitely. I remember in first year TRU Law was extremely new, and I looked up the requirements, and this past year checked them out, it's insane how much they've jumped up.
I think articling takes about 10 months. The program at Lakehead takes about 4 months, I believe. But that's still a lot of time saved. Although, I would still prefer to article and gain experience rather than going Lakehead's route.
You're so lucky you live in such a beautiful community. TRU is up and coming and has won some very prestigious law competitions over established law schools like UBC and UVic. TRU law is definitely going to get more competitive over the years.
Wow that's incredible actually! That would save you like a year right? Damn.
Also I actually live where Thompson Rivers is haha, so I'm well aware of it, it's a new school, but it definitely has its benefits, the general community here is really nice and welcoming.
Well, look at you! We look forward to having you on the call[s] this week :)
Nice!! I'd love to go to a law school in BC. One of my coworkers moved from Ontario to BC to work there and he LOVES it. Also, BC has amazing law schools...Thompson Rivers University, Victoria, UBC are all awesome! But, I was actually looking at the youngest law school in Canada (Lakehead, which is in Thunder Bay, Ontario) and they say that you don't need to article after graduation anymore. You just go through a program that they have and pass the bar exam. Then, it's you versus the world!
Anyways, totally off topic. I read about your recent achievements and I'm happy for you. Keep up the great work man!
Nice dude! Breaking plateaus always feels great. And I have a feeling you'll come to look forward to the comparative passages; I find them easier in general than the others: quicker reads, more to work with, and the relationship between the passages is rarely opaque.