I'd like to know about " The only". Is this a NA indicator, even if THE is in front of it? We have no info about it. Thanks. The only answer I need is about this question.
Yes! Thank you. I researched this over the last 2 months! It’s actually “ the only- only “ that is sufficient!! All the other “ only”’s are necessary indicators 😊
#feedback What is the point of the timing posted next to the articles? Should I really only be taking 1-3 minutes to read and absorb these complicated topics? I find that I want to complete a full section when I study and have drawn up a schedule based on the syllabus. But, at least through the early portion of the course, this is very dense information, and the study times are misleading.
I'm glad I'm not the only one. I just thought I was an incredibly slow reader with these. My schedule is 1 hour a day and I go much more to keep up with the schedule I've made. #feedback
This is super reassuring as I am setting up my study schedule to do 2 hours a day on top of being a full time high school science teacher -- I feel like I am getting through these so slowly & it is discouraging. How is the 1 hour a day method working? Does it get better? SOS
Theres no way that anyone can go through these in like 1-2 minutes or even thirty minutes . I legit wrote down flashcards and will now be memorizing which could take me like an hour or more. The 1-2 minute thing is super misleading and if you're doing everything that quickly , it for sure is not the right way to study. I take hours on the drills because I understand the drilling part is super important to really understand the content and understand the grammar. This section has been taking me especially slow.
I think as you get better at recognizing these drills/patterns you wont be needing to spend quite as much time. Some lessons I immediately grasp and my brain is always able to make a differentiation, you should be studying to be able to rapidly recognize patterns as opposed to trying to memorize them.
I am a full-time teacher, too. I am glad I have some time to study before school starts, but I am not mentally prepared for how exhausted I will be after teaching and then needing to study for 2 hours.
Hi there! It's the morning of my first LSAT and I came back to this lesson to review the 4 groups before heading off to my test. I saw your comment and thought I'd contribute my two cents: you don't need to necessarily memorize these indicators right now. As you move into LR and continue practicing conditional logic, you'll notice these indicators kind of become second nature to you. Some of them will stick immediately and they'll mostly be intuitive for you. You may struggle to remember others (hence why I'm reviewing this right now, "no" always makes me second-guess myself). The LSAT uses some of these indicators far more frequently than others (I'd say if, when, every, all, only, must, always, unless, and no are the most common). Refer back to this once in a while throughout LR and apply what you know, but don't stress about memorizing them fully right now. You'll understand them better once you see them in action :)
i think i need much more fleshed out definitions of what a sufficient relationship and a necessary relationship are with some examples. Can't seem to wrap my head around the concepts and fully grasp them within the real world.
@MPFerrari Hey, I might be a little late but something that I think helps me out a lot is "if x then y" x is sufficient and y is necessary. X is enough to satisfy Y but Y is required to make X true. Does this make sense?
Ex: If I am in Chicago, I am in Illinois.
Chicago is the sufficient here. It guarantees that I'm in Illinois (my Y) because Chicago is a city within Illinois.
Illinois cannot be the sufficient in this case. Just because I am in Illinois doesn't guarantee that I am in Chicago. Chicago only makes up lets say <1% of Illinois total ground. I could theoretically be in Champaign. (At the University of Illinois)
Does this make sense?
Here is another example that could help:
If I drink redbull then I will grow wings.
Sufficient: drinking redbull
Why? Drinking redbull is sufficient to make you grow wings.
But I cannot say growing wings is sufficient or enough to be drinking redbull.
Why? Because what if I somehow mutated. Died and became an angel? There are endless possibilities that are not listed.
Sufficient: enough to guarantee.
Necessary: must be true for outcome to be possible
Thanks, we’ll put together something like this. Would you prefer the info in visual diagrams (like you’ve seen in the lessons) or in a chart (like in this lesson https://7sage.com/lesson/logical-reasoning-cheat-sheet/
Im so lost what is the difference between group 3 and 4 if it doesn't matter which side you choose. technically you are doing the exact same thing just you decide which is going to be sufficient or necessary based on which idea you choose?
@lsatdiva12345 Remember that the rules aren't any fundamental information about the logic, they're just shortcuts that help you jot down a lawgic implication correctly when you see one of the logical indicator words. The point of the rules is that in group 3 the sufficient condition is negated, and in group 4 the necessary condition is negated. Maybe it would be a good illustration if you built your own implications in the group-3 and group-4 patterns (/A -> B, and A -> /B), and then translated them into English. You will likely find that the words you need to use for the group 3 pattern are words like or, unless, until, without, and that you'll need no, none, not both, cannot for group 4.
@lsatdiva12345 Said differently, the logical notions built into the group 3 and group 4 rules are descriptions of how English uses these sets of logical indicator words (at least in the context of LSAT questions).
Does this mean everyone who studied got an A? No -- just that everyone who got an A studied. But, there could have been many people who studied who did not get an A. So here, "the only" introduces the "if" part of the conditional:
Got an A --> Studied
"Only people who studied got an A."
This expresses the same relationship above. It's not saying everyone who studied got an A. It's saying studying was necessary for an A. Only people with that quality got an A. Here, "only" introduces what's necessary.
@Kevin_Lin Can't you just remove the "the" or add a "the" in each of your examples and get the same meaning? Still not seeing how adding "the" before "only" changes the entire meaning of the sentence compared to just "only"
@epayne17 "The only people who make over $50 million a year are pro athletes."
What's sufficient and necessary in that example? Is that saying everyone who makes over $50 mill a year is a pro athlete? Or that every pro athlete makes over $50 mill a year?
"Only people who are tall are good at basketball."
What's that saying? That everyone who is tall is good at basketball, or that everyone who is good at basketball is tall?
@Kevin_Lin Right, so removing "the", resulting in "Only people who make over $50M a year are pro athletes" has the exact same meaning than when you have "the" at the front....
@KevinLin Starting to feel like all these minor rules are just distracting to real questions. I end up taking far longer converting claims to lawgic than i would to just comprehend the passage normally.
What does this mean to you, in an if-then form? Can you translate this to an if-then form? (Don't try to see where I'm going with this -- I'm just curious about your intuitive understanding of this statement.)
"The only people who make over $50 million are pro athletes."
109 comments
Group 1: Sufficient Condition
Indicators: if, when, where, all, every, any
If
Example: "If it rains, the ground gets wet."
- Sufficient Condition: It rains
- Necessary Condition: The ground gets wet
- When
Example: "When the sun sets, it gets dark."
- Sufficient Condition: The sun sets
- Necessary Condition: It gets dark
- Where
Example: "Where there is smoke, there is fire."
- Sufficient Condition: There is smoke
- Necessary Condition: There is fire
- All
Example: "All mammals are warm-blooded."
- Sufficient Condition: Being a mammal
- Necessary Condition: Being warm-blooded
- Every
Example: "Every student must submit homework."
- Sufficient Condition: Being a student
- Necessary Condition: Must submit homework
- Any
Example: "Any person can learn to code."
- Sufficient Condition: Being a person
- Necessary Condition: Can learn to code
Group 2: Necessary Condition
Indicators: only, only if, only when, only where, always, must
- Only
Example: "Only graduates can attend the ceremony."
- Sufficient Condition: Can attend the ceremony
- Necessary Condition: Being a graduate
- Only if
Example: "You can drive only if you have a license."
- Sufficient Condition: Can drive
- Necessary Condition: Have a license
- Only when
Example: "The alarm rings only when there is a fire."
- Sufficient Condition: The alarm rings
- Necessary Condition: There is a fire
- Only where
Example: "Success is found only where hard work is done."
- Sufficient Condition: Success is found
- Necessary Condition: Hard work is done
- Always
Example: "Honesty is always the best policy."
- Sufficient Condition: Honesty
- Necessary Condition: Best policy
- Must
Example: "You must study to pass the exam."
- Sufficient Condition: Pass the exam
- Necessary Condition: Study
Group 3: Negate and Sufficient Condition
Indicators: or, unless, until, without
- Or
Example: "You can have cake or ice cream."
- Pick either idea: Have cake
- Negate: Don't have cake
- Sufficient Condition: Don't have cake
- Necessary Condition: Have ice cream
- Unless
Example: "You cannot enter unless you have a ticket."
- Pick either idea: Have a ticket
- Negate: Don't have a ticket
- Sufficient Condition: Don't have a ticket
- Necessary Condition: Cannot enter
- Until
Example: "You cannot leave until you finish your work."
- Pick either idea: Finish your work
- Negate: Don't finish your work
- Sufficient Condition: Don't finish your work
- Necessary Condition: Cannot leave
- Without
Example: "You cannot succeed without effort."
- Pick either idea: Effort
- Negate: No effort
- Sufficient Condition: No effort
- Necessary Condition: Cannot succeed
Group 4: Negate and Necessary Condition
Indicators: no, none, not both, cannot
- No
Example: "No student can leave early."
- Pick either idea: Student can leave early
- Negate: Student cannot leave early
- Sufficient Condition: Being a student
- Necessary Condition: Cannot leave early
- None
Example: "None of the lights are on."
- Pick either idea: Lights are on
- Negate: Lights are not on
- Sufficient Condition: Lights
- Necessary Condition: Not on
- Not both
Example: "You cannot be both a manager and a worker."
- Pick either idea: Be a manager
- Negate: Not a manager
- Sufficient Condition: Be a worker
- Necessary Condition: Not a manager
- Cannot
Example: "A square cannot be a circle."
- Pick either idea: Square
- Negate: Not a square
- Sufficient Condition: Be a circle
- Necessary Condition: Not a square
THANKYOU!!!
not all heroes wear capes!! thank you
I'd like to know about " The only". Is this a NA indicator, even if THE is in front of it? We have no info about it. Thanks. The only answer I need is about this question.
I believe that "The only" is group 1, it indicates the sufficient condition.
Yes! Thank you. I researched this over the last 2 months! It’s actually “ the only- only “ that is sufficient!! All the other “ only”’s are necessary indicators 😊
#feedback What is the point of the timing posted next to the articles? Should I really only be taking 1-3 minutes to read and absorb these complicated topics? I find that I want to complete a full section when I study and have drawn up a schedule based on the syllabus. But, at least through the early portion of the course, this is very dense information, and the study times are misleading.
Amen. Hopefully after Foundations it's more accurate. Really looking forward to JY releasing CCv2 videos too.
I thought it was just me because the skillbuiders can take me hours to do cause there are too many builders.
I totally agree, even more so when you are trying to take notes to remember #feedback
I'm glad I'm not the only one. I just thought I was an incredibly slow reader with these. My schedule is 1 hour a day and I go much more to keep up with the schedule I've made. #feedback
This is super reassuring as I am setting up my study schedule to do 2 hours a day on top of being a full time high school science teacher -- I feel like I am getting through these so slowly & it is discouraging. How is the 1 hour a day method working? Does it get better? SOS
Yeah exactly. Also, the drills take me 1-2 hrs. a piece even though they require "30 minutes." That's with writing some of them down.
Theres no way that anyone can go through these in like 1-2 minutes or even thirty minutes . I legit wrote down flashcards and will now be memorizing which could take me like an hour or more. The 1-2 minute thing is super misleading and if you're doing everything that quickly , it for sure is not the right way to study. I take hours on the drills because I understand the drilling part is super important to really understand the content and understand the grammar. This section has been taking me especially slow.
I think as you get better at recognizing these drills/patterns you wont be needing to spend quite as much time. Some lessons I immediately grasp and my brain is always able to make a differentiation, you should be studying to be able to rapidly recognize patterns as opposed to trying to memorize them.
thank you for this comment. I keep mistakenly thinking that I don't understand a concept simply b/c I don't have it memorized.
I am a full-time teacher, too. I am glad I have some time to study before school starts, but I am not mentally prepared for how exhausted I will be after teaching and then needing to study for 2 hours.
@capturingthemomentmedia734 How many skill builder exercises do you see? Where are they? I only see 5 on each skill builder lesson.
I made flash cards to help memorize group 1-4 conditional indicators, thought I’d share in case it would be helpful to anyone else. I’m redoing this course after getting through most of it and taking the lsat and not doing as well as I hoped. Looking back I realize how important it is to know these. https://quizlet.com/1153975729/lsat-7sage-conditional-indicators-to-share-flash-cards/?i=71yhg9&x=1jqY
@Elideebeep you are so lit for this. thank you!!
@HiGigi 🔥 no problem
It would be great if the diagram had one example for each group. #feedback
I am starting to get this with each passing day. Let's not give up!
Lowkey this one was really confusing :/
"only" in group 2 vs "the only" in group 1 is cruel and unusual
he should include examples.
#feedback
Anyone else struggling with remembering all of these?
Hi there! It's the morning of my first LSAT and I came back to this lesson to review the 4 groups before heading off to my test. I saw your comment and thought I'd contribute my two cents: you don't need to necessarily memorize these indicators right now. As you move into LR and continue practicing conditional logic, you'll notice these indicators kind of become second nature to you. Some of them will stick immediately and they'll mostly be intuitive for you. You may struggle to remember others (hence why I'm reviewing this right now, "no" always makes me second-guess myself). The LSAT uses some of these indicators far more frequently than others (I'd say if, when, every, all, only, must, always, unless, and no are the most common). Refer back to this once in a while throughout LR and apply what you know, but don't stress about memorizing them fully right now. You'll understand them better once you see them in action :)
hell yeah
The reinforcement has me crying.
I tried to work it out but I couldn't figure it out lol, I don't know if I was supposed to work it out or if its even possible lol.
#feedback maybe there could be examples for each of these types one more time. Just to help reinforce the ideas.
Are we not getting videos anymore? They were very helpful
I'm back reviewing these after getting one shotted by MBT questions
We should use examples from passages. #Feedback
@LeonardoFernandez I assume they are coming ahead lol
i think i need much more fleshed out definitions of what a sufficient relationship and a necessary relationship are with some examples. Can't seem to wrap my head around the concepts and fully grasp them within the real world.
@MPFerrari Hey, I might be a little late but something that I think helps me out a lot is "if x then y" x is sufficient and y is necessary. X is enough to satisfy Y but Y is required to make X true. Does this make sense?
Ex: If I am in Chicago, I am in Illinois.
Chicago is the sufficient here. It guarantees that I'm in Illinois (my Y) because Chicago is a city within Illinois.
Illinois cannot be the sufficient in this case. Just because I am in Illinois doesn't guarantee that I am in Chicago. Chicago only makes up lets say <1% of Illinois total ground. I could theoretically be in Champaign. (At the University of Illinois)
Does this make sense?
Here is another example that could help:
If I drink redbull then I will grow wings.
Sufficient: drinking redbull
Why? Drinking redbull is sufficient to make you grow wings.
But I cannot say growing wings is sufficient or enough to be drinking redbull.
Why? Because what if I somehow mutated. Died and became an angel? There are endless possibilities that are not listed.
Sufficient: enough to guarantee.
Necessary: must be true for outcome to be possible
I think it means it is sufficient to make the conclusion true...
like if I am in Austin, then I am in Texas.
Austin is sufficient to guarantee that I'm in Texas.
but Texas does not guarantee I'm in Austin.
but if I am in Austin then it is also necessarily true that I am also in Texas.
I don't understand the comic
@abboshap560 subsets and supersets. girlfriends are a subset of the superset, the world. if there is no world, there can be no girlfriends.
@nml
If GF then W
/W then /GF?
@AbeShapiro yes i think so!!!! lol
[This comment was deleted.]
that would be amazing #feedback
#feedback
Thanks, we’ll put together something like this. Would you prefer the info in visual diagrams (like you’ve seen in the lessons) or in a chart (like in this lesson https://7sage.com/lesson/logical-reasoning-cheat-sheet/
Visual Diagrams please
I think both would be beneficial. I believe the charts can retain a bit more information than visual diagrams. Thanks ◡̈
I like the cheat sheet option. Where would we be able to locate this?
Has this been made yet?
@Kevin_Lin Cheat sheet is here! https://7sage.com/pages/free-lsat-resources-conditionals-cheat-sheet
Hey! Any chance you can make these diagrams downloadable?
Memorizing this will not be fun, but I hope it's worth it
Im so lost what is the difference between group 3 and 4 if it doesn't matter which side you choose. technically you are doing the exact same thing just you decide which is going to be sufficient or necessary based on which idea you choose?
@lsatdiva12345 Remember that the rules aren't any fundamental information about the logic, they're just shortcuts that help you jot down a lawgic implication correctly when you see one of the logical indicator words. The point of the rules is that in group 3 the sufficient condition is negated, and in group 4 the necessary condition is negated. Maybe it would be a good illustration if you built your own implications in the group-3 and group-4 patterns (/A -> B, and A -> /B), and then translated them into English. You will likely find that the words you need to use for the group 3 pattern are words like or, unless, until, without, and that you'll need no, none, not both, cannot for group 4.
@lsatdiva12345 Said differently, the logical notions built into the group 3 and group 4 rules are descriptions of how English uses these sets of logical indicator words (at least in the context of LSAT questions).
@lsatdiva12345 i had to stop thinking about is as the 'choose whichever one' advice and instead make the rules:
'unless, without, or, until' = treat as introducing a necessary condition with a negated sufficient condition (/A --> B)
'no, none, not both, cannot' = treat as introducing a sufficient condition with a negated necessary condition (A --> /B)
Whats the concept behind "never"? Its not listed on the diagram as an indicator but was used in an example
@Kerington43 never is a group 4 negate, necessary indicator that functions the same as cannot.
If you don't read the comic, you're missing out.
@fjnathaniel /(reading the comic) -> missing out lol
I'm confused on how "the only" in group 1 differs from "only" in group 2. Does anyone have an example of how this works?
"The only people who got an A studied."
Does this mean everyone who studied got an A? No -- just that everyone who got an A studied. But, there could have been many people who studied who did not get an A. So here, "the only" introduces the "if" part of the conditional:
Got an A --> Studied
"Only people who studied got an A."
This expresses the same relationship above. It's not saying everyone who studied got an A. It's saying studying was necessary for an A. Only people with that quality got an A. Here, "only" introduces what's necessary.
"Got an A --> studied"
@Kevin_Lin Can't you just remove the "the" or add a "the" in each of your examples and get the same meaning? Still not seeing how adding "the" before "only" changes the entire meaning of the sentence compared to just "only"
@epayne17 "The only people who make over $50 million a year are pro athletes."
What's sufficient and necessary in that example? Is that saying everyone who makes over $50 mill a year is a pro athlete? Or that every pro athlete makes over $50 mill a year?
"Only people who are tall are good at basketball."
What's that saying? That everyone who is tall is good at basketball, or that everyone who is good at basketball is tall?
@Kevin_Lin Right, so removing "the", resulting in "Only people who make over $50M a year are pro athletes" has the exact same meaning than when you have "the" at the front....
@KevinLin Starting to feel like all these minor rules are just distracting to real questions. I end up taking far longer converting claims to lawgic than i would to just comprehend the passage normally.
@epayne17
What does this mean to you, in an if-then form? Can you translate this to an if-then form? (Don't try to see where I'm going with this -- I'm just curious about your intuitive understanding of this statement.)
"The only people who make over $50 million are pro athletes."