I'm wrapping up my Master's degree and I have some extra space in my schedule next semester. I've been planning to take an easy, intro-level course in a subject outside of my degree to get myself to the full-time hour requirement, but I'm not sure how that will look to law schools. Do y'all think they'll view it as me slacking in my last semester? Should I add another graduate level course instead?

Hi I'm looking for someone to read my personal statement and diversity statement.

Hello, Does anyone know an approximate good length for personal statements, how long should the personal statement be? The general personal statement for law school. Thanks

I'm wondering if I should write a GPA Addendum relating to ADHD. I'm currently undecided, as I've read many conflicting opinions online (some saying it could hurt my application.) Here is my story:

So, I was diagnosed with ADHD in middle school and took medication up until the end of high school. I stopped because despite trying several alternative medications and dosages, the side effects of weight loss and anxiety were far harsher than the medications' benefits. Throughout most of college, I felt not taking the medicine was more beneficial for my mental and physical well-being at the expense of the disability impeding on my academic performance and being unrepresentative of my intelligence. This past summer (2024), I spoke with my psychiatrist and started taking a new medication that alleviates the symptoms of ADHD and doesn't have any nasty side effects. Currently, I am performing at the top of most of my classes but my worry is that this is meaningless because the proof isn't on my transcript. My CAS GPA is a 3.04.

So do I write it? Let me know if y'all have any questions.

During my undergrad I spent time working and earning college credit in various labs (neuroscience, psychology, and criminology). These labs offered me a lot of experience. I am very proud of the work that I completed and grateful for the opportunities. I want to highlight this experience somewhere in my application because I believe it was a big part of my undergrad career and it contributed to my personal development. The work has not yet been formally published. I think it would fit in my resume, but I am unsure where it would most make sense. Experience seems tricky because it was not a paid position but it also does not seem to fit well into Education. Any advice is appreciated!

I am currently a sophomore and plan to take a gap semester to better prepare for LSAT and internships. Will this gap year influence my law school admissions. Should I justify and explain reasons of this gap semester when I apply? I am confused and genuinely appreciate some answers!

I have an old GRE score from June 2021 that was required to enter into a grad program (just had to take it, score didnt matter). that being said the score is kinda abysmal. do I have to report it? esp since my lsat scores are recent (sept & nov of this year)

Greetings 7Sagers!

On Wednesday, October 30 at 8pm ET, join 7Sage admissions consultants Taj McCoy and Dr. Sam Riley for another panel discussion with law school admissions deans from across the country. For this conversation, hear from representatives of Boston College, Catholic University, Howard University, Loyola University Chicago, Loyola Los Angeles, the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, as they weigh in on strategizing character and fitness statements and various addenda. The audience will be able to submit questions on this topic throughout the session via the Q&A widget.

*Note: The session will be recorded and will be posted to our podcast after it's edited for sound quality.

Registration link: https://7sage.zoom.us/meeting/register/tZ0qdeyvqTspHNZIEW2NUAEUp7Os38rVcuC-

hi! I am a teach for america teacher who taught in the nyc doe for 3 years, & resigned in june (at the end of the school year). when the summer break started (july), I was accepted to an education policy & advocacy fellowship in nyc that was 2 months long, which ended sept 8th ish

I am applying right now, & currently unemployed - main reason being: I got married early october & was away the majority of the month. I took sept & nov lsats & studying during my downtime all summer & when I wasnt working in sept/when I got back end of oct before nov lsat. other reason being the market in nyc is crazy & I do not think ill be able to get a job that is law school-esk (legal secretary, paralegal, etc) to just work for 6 months before going to school. I will probably continue my job as a volleyball coach & supplement with another retail job to pay the bills until school.

now my question: since I am applying by the end of the month, are schools going to be wondering about my current employment status? do I need to submit an addendum for this? I feel like its a moo point but also idk?

Basically, as it says, there's a question in my application that wants me to list all the other schools I'm applying to. As of right now, I am only applying to one other school - but I will likely apply to more later on. Any advice on what I should do in this case?

If a university's personal statement prompt doesn't mention "why our school," would you still end on a note highlighting that specific university? Or would you just end stating why you want to attend law school in general?

My first LSAT was 8/24 and I got a 156. My most recent one was 10/24 and I managed to raise my score to a 166 which is odd because at the time I was Pting around 160. Even recently I have not scored a PT over 166 at all. I am signed up for November but i'm thinking of canceling and just applying with the 166. My GPA is not the highest (3.3) but i'm burnt out and working on apps. I almost think i'm scoring worse now compared with 2 weeks ago. Should I chance it but risk getting a worse score than 166? Any advice?

Okay, I've been basing my applications/chances off of the admissions predictor on 7Sage......problem is I just looked the the predictor on LSAC and my odds look ALOT worse. I know LSAC doesn't have the option to choose what month you apply but even still the disconnect is making me nervous. Anyone know why this is and which is more accurate?

I am taking the november lsat, but also plan on applying to some schools before scores are released. How do I make sure schools receive my new scores? Do I need to send it to them or tell them there is a new score on file or will they automatically be updated.

#help

#lsat

#admissions

Do our references have to have submitted the reference before NOV 1 or can I submit my applicaiton and still have their submission be pending? One of my references has still not completed it but it says viewed on my applicaiton.

Admin note: Edited title. Please do not post threads or comments in all caps. This is against the Forum Rules. Thanks!

I'm a non-URM with a 4.0 and a 172. PT average about the same with a few (recent) scores between 174 and 177. Is it worth taking again in November? My top choices are Michigan and Northwestern.

Hey all! Just out of curiosity, where is everyone planning to apply and why? My top choice is University of South Carolina since I want to live there and the law school facilities themselves and faculty are amazing. But I went undergrad at University of Kentucky so I will be applying there too, as well as FSU since I am a Florida native and want to keep my options open. If anyone was looking at going to UK and has questions about the school or Lexington in general, or if you're like me and want to go to USC, feel free to reach out and DM me!

Military vet reaching out to anyone applying in this current cycle only who wants support, resources, and camaraderie among soon to be peers, as we navigate this application process together. Best of luck to everyone!

https://discord.gg/ybV969fq

I am in a strange situation. I have a decent GPA and LSAT score, but I am only applying to in-state schools, all which happen to be pretty competitive. So, my GPA is a 3.77 and my LSAT is a 156. Here are the stats for the school I am applying to:

Median GPA 3.87 (25th and 75th percentile between 3.70 and 3.95) And Median LSAT 165 (25th and 75th percentile between 161 and 167)

I applied last year with roughly the same scores, slightly lower GPA and an LSAT of 155, and I was waitlisted and eventually not admitted. I had a really strong personal statement and resume, which I think helped compensate for my scores. Anyways, reapplying this year with my 156 (which came out today, super bummer on this.)

Anyways, all to say, should I write an addendum for my 156? I think my reasoning would just be lack of resources to low-income students and within my specific university. For some background, I aged out of foster care and have been funding my legal journey on my own. I also own my own home (I am 23 years old), which is super expensive and the reason I cannot devote more money to LSAT resources or applying to out of state schools.

What now? Addendum? Not apply this year at all and start studying for next year? Desperately in need of advice. Thank you all! And I hope the best for all of you in your legal journeys!

Hey guys, I am currently finalizing my applications but am on the fence if I should submit an optional essay for this prompt:

"You are not required to submit an optional statement. However, you may upload an optional statement regarding any economic, cultural, social, or other factors that you wish for us to consider when reviewing your application. Your optional statement should not exceed two pages (double-spaced) with a minimum of one-inch margins and a 10-point font size. Your decision not to provide an optional statement does not adversely impact the review of your application."

Am I wrong in interpreting this as a diversity statement? For context, my optional essay is about how Washington state mountaineering culture influenced my identity and instilled perseverance and tenacity in me. I do NOT want to submit this and come off as tone deaf or ignorant to admission officers if others are writing about URM status and going through real struggles rather than writing about hobbies. Any thoughts or advice?

Are you planning to apply to law school this year? We’re offering a FREE in-person admissions events in DC.

Washington, D.C. - Saturday, November 16th - 12:00 to 4:00 PM ET

Tajira McCoy, former head of admissions at Berkeley, will be joined by the head of admissions at Howard, Tracy Simmons, for a law school applications event in DC! The two admissions experts will give a presentation on how to successfully prepare your applications followed by some time for Q&A and one-on-one help. We will be requiring a $50 deposit refunded upon attendance to secure a spot. Make your deposit here.

Hi All, I am currently working on writing my diversity statement. I want to write about my experience living in poverty. I recently read the nonfiction book, "Poverty, by America" by Matthew Desmond and it articulates a lot about poverty that I want to reference in my essay. I am wondering if it is appropriate to use quotes from the book such as, "Poverty reduces people born for better things" or "Poverty is diminished life and personhood. It changes how you think and prevents you from realizing your full potential". I want to use quotes like above to try to define/explain the ways in which poverty has affected my life while also referencing an intellectual source not only to substantiate my experience but also exemplify my academic ability to analyze a piece of work in my own experience. Any advice would be greatly appreciated! TIA

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around some of these public interest essays (like Root-Tilden, Berk Public Interest Scholars, and general supplemental essays). I can't find a single example anywhere. Has anyone managed to find some?

Does anyone have suggestions on how to approach this? I am not sure if it needs to be a personal story or if I can just talk about my work experience. I'm running out of creative juice.

As many of you have likely heard by now, Yale, Harvard, and now Berkeley have announced that they will no longer participate in the US News and World Report law school rankings process. More schools are likely to follow in the days and weeks to come. The US News rankings have long been a staple in law school admissions. I’ve been through law school, several of my own admissions cycles, and hundreds more cycles by proxy through my students, and no single event has come anywhere close to the level of impact this will have. So let’s break down what this means and how it affects applicants.

#####What were the US News rankings?

This part is perhaps the most confusing aspect in all of this. The US News rankings were just what they sound like: The law school rankings established by one random publication--The otherwise unremarkable US News & World Report. There are other rankings by other entities--The ATL rankings are a great alternative--but for some reason it was the US News rankings that became the "official" rankings. The T14 schools were the schools ranked in the top 14 in the US News rankings. There is no particular reason for this ever having been the case. US News has no special indicia of legitimacy making their rankings supreme. Despite the arbitrariness of it all, it has provided a universal standard.

#####How were the rankings determined?

Here's the methodology, copied straight from US News:

####Quality Assessment

Quality assessment was composed of two indicators of expert opinion that contributed 40% to the overall rank.

Peer assessment score (weighted by 0.25): Law school deans, deans of academic affairs, chairs of faculty appointments and the most recently tenured faculty members rated programs' overall quality on a scale from marginal (1) to outstanding (5), marking "don't know" for schools they did not know well enough to evaluate. A school's score is the average of 1-5 ratings received. U.S. News administered the peer assessment survey in fall 2021 and early 2022. Sixty nine percent of recipients responded.

Lawyers and judges assessment score (0.15): Legal professionals – including hiring partners of law firms, practicing attorneys and judges – rated programs' overall quality on a scale from 1 (marginal) to 5 (outstanding), marking "don't know" for schools they did not know well enough to evaluate. A school's score is the average of 1-5 ratings it received across the three most recent survey years. U.S. News administered the legal professionals survey in fall 2021 and early 2022 to recipients that law schools provided to U.S. News in summer 2021.

####Placement Success

Placement success is composed of five indicators that total 26% (previously 25.25%) of each school's rank. The two most heavily weighted indicators pertain to employment.

Employment rates for 2020 graduates 10 months after graduation (0.14) and at graduation (0.04): For both ranking factors, schools received maximum credit when their J.D. graduates – in alignment with ABA reporting rules – obtained long-term jobs that were full time, not funded by the law school, and where a J.D. degree was an advantage or bar passage was required. In contrast, jobs that were some combination of short term, part time, funded by the law school and/or did not require bar passage received less credit by varying amounts, determined by the combination. For a more detailed explanation, see Notes on Employment Rates, below.

Bar passage rate (0.03, previously 0.0225): U.S. News revamped its treatment of bar passage rates to incorporate all graduates who took the bar for the first time. Computations were further modified to de-emphasize the impact of geography on law schools' relative performance.

Specifically, the bar passage rate indicator scored schools on their 2020 first-time test takers' weighted bar passage rates among all jurisdictions (states), then added or subtracted the percentage point difference between those rates and the weighted state average among ABA accredited schools' first-time test takers in the corresponding jurisdictions in 2020. This meant schools that performed best on this ranking factor graduated students whose bar passage rates were both higher than most schools overall, and higher compared with what was typical among graduates who took the bar in corresponding jurisdictions.

For example, if a law school graduated 100 students who first took the bar exam – and 88 took the Florida exam, 10 the Georgia exam and two the South Carolina exam – the school's weighted average rate would use pass rate results that were weighted 88% Florida, 10% Georgia and 2% South Carolina. This computation would then be compared with an index of these jurisdictions' average pass rates – also weighted 88-10-2. (For privacy, school profiles on usnews.com only display bar passage data for jurisdictions with at least 10 test-takers.) Both weighted averages included any graduates who passed the bar with diploma privilege. Diploma privilege is a method for J.D. graduates to be admitted to a state bar and allowed to practice law in that state without taking that state's actual bar examination. Diploma privilege is generally based on attending and graduating from a law school in that state with the diploma privilege.

In previous editions, U.S. News divided each school's first-time bar passage rate in its single jurisdiction with the most test-takers by the average for that lone jurisdiction. This approach effectively excluded many law schools' graduates who took the bar. Dividing by the state average also meant the location of a law school impacted its quotient as much as its graduates' bar passage rate itself. The new arithmetic accounts for average passage rates across all applicable jurisdictions as proxy for each exam's difficulty and reflects that passing the bar is a critical outcome measure in itself.

Average debt incurred obtaining a J.D. at graduation (0.03) and the percent of law school graduates incurring J.D. law school debt (0.02): According to a 2021 American Bar Association report, many new lawyers are postponing major life decisions like marriage, having children and buying houses – or rejecting them outright – because they are carrying heavy student loan debts. J.D. graduate debt is impacting Black and Hispanic students the most since they borrow more, according to the ABA. For the second consecutive year, the ranking includes two indicators that took into account this J.D. graduate debt load and its impact on law school graduates, the legal profession and prospective law school students.

This data was based on J.D. candidate graduates in 2020-2021. The indicators were calculated by comparing each school's value with the median value (midpoint) for that indicator. Schools whose values were farthest below the median scored the highest, and schools that were most above the median scored the lowest on each indicator.

####Selectivity

Selectivity is a proxy of student excellence. Its three indicators contributed 21% in total to the ranking.

Median Law School Admission Test and Graduate Record Examination scores (0.1125): These are the combined median scores on the LSAT and GRE quantitative, verbal and analytical writing exams of all 2021 full- and part-time entrants to the J.D. program. Reported scores for each of the four exams, when applicable, were converted to 0-100 percentile scales. The LSAT and GRE percentile scales were weighted by the proportions of test-takers submitting each exam. For example, if 85% of exams submitted were LSATs and 15% submitted were GREs, the LSAT percentile would be multiplied by 0.85 and the average percentile of the three GRE exams by 0.15 before summing the two values. This means GRE scores were never converted to LSAT scores or vice versa. There were 59 law schools – 31% of the total ranked law schools – that reported both the LSAT and GRE scores of their 2021 entering classes to U.S. News.

Median undergraduate grade point average (0.0875): This is the combined median undergraduate GPA of all 2021 full- and part-time entrants to the J.D. program. Law schools with higher median GPAs scored higher on this indicator.

Acceptance rate (0.01): This is the combined proportion of applicants to both the full- and part-time J.D. programs who were accepted for the 2021 entering class. A lower acceptance rate scored higher because this indicated greater selectivity.

####Faculty, Law School and Library Resources

Faculty, law school and library resources is comprised of four indicators weighted at 13% (previously 13.75%) of the ranking and is composed of two indicators on expenditures, one on student-faculty ratio and one for library resources. The two metrics on expenditures per student, below, pertain to the 2020 and 2021 fiscal years.

The average spending on instruction, library and supporting services (0.09) and the average spending on all other items, including financial aid (0.01): The faculty resources calculation for instruction, library and supporting services is adjusted for cost of living variations in law school salaries between school geographic locations by using publicly available Bureau of Economic Analysis Regional Price Parities index data.

Student-faculty ratio (0.02): This is the ratio of law school students to law school faculty members for 2021. The student-to-faculty ratio definition that U.S. News uses is a modified version of the Common Data Set's definition, a standard used throughout higher education based on the ratio of full-time equivalent students to full-time equivalent faculty. For law schools, full-time equivalent faculty is defined as full-time faculty plus one-third part-time law school faculty. Full-time equivalent students are defined as full-time law school students plus two-thirds of total part-time law school students.

Library resources and operations (0.01, previously 0.017): Following additional examination of their data, U.S. News has discontinued using the seven library indicators used once in the previous ranking. In their place is one new indicator: The ratio of full-time equivalent professional librarian positions as of June 30, 2021 (or the close of a law school's fiscal year) to fall 2021 full-time equivalent law students.

#####Why are schools opting out?

Like most things, Erwin Chemerinsky said it better than anyone else could. Professor Chemerinsky is the dean of Berkeley Law School, probably the greatest living Constitutional Law scholar, and hopefully the next Supreme Court Justice of the United States:

After careful consideration, Berkeley Law has decided not to continue to participate in the US News ranking of law schools. Although rankings are inevitable and inevitably have some arbitrary features, there are aspects of the US News rankings that are profoundly inconsistent with our values and public mission.

Berkeley Law is a public school, with a deep commitment to increasing access to justice, training attorneys who will work to improve society in a variety of ways, and to empowering the next generation of leaders and thinkers, many of whom will come from communities who historically were not part of the legal profession. We are also committed to excellence: in our programs, scholarship, financial support, research, and certainly among our students. We take pride in producing attorneys who are highly skilled, highly sought after, and dedicated to public service and pro bono. This is who we are.

Rankings have the meaning that we give them as a community. I do not want to pretend they do not. And rankings will exist with or without our participation. The question becomes, then, do we think that there is a benefit to participation in the US News process that outweighs the costs? The answer, we feel, is no.

We want to be specific about the basis for this assertion. It is not about railing against rankings or complaining that they “hurt” us in some way. However, there are specific issues that we have struggled with for years, and raised with leadership at US News to no avail. These are:

Their ranking penalizes schools that help students launch careers in public service law.

Berkeley Law has a program where we provide students a fellowship for a year after graduation to work in a public interest organization. These positions include a salary comparable to an entry-level position in public service or public interest, as well as a stipend during study for the bar examination. We have done this for many years and 94 percent of those who receive such fellowships remain doing public interest law after the fellowship ends. But US News does not count these students as fully employed. This creates a perverse incentive for schools to eliminate these positions, despite their success and despite the training they provide for future public service attorneys.

Moreover, consistent with our public mission, we have one of the most favorable loan repayment assistance programs in the country. We have recently revised it to make it even more helpful to our graduates pursuing public interest and public service careers. US News pays no attention to this, measuring student debt but ignoring how schools are helping students who need assistance to repay it.

The USNWR ranking formula disregards and discounts graduates who are pursuing advanced degrees.

We are pleased that every year some pursue Ph.D. and MBA degrees. More than pleased; we are a law school that trains scholars, and seeks to add new voices to legal academia and other university spaces. Yet these graduates count as “unemployed” in the US News methodology. While we maintain a faculty committee dedicated to helping graduates and students pursue legal academia, we are one of the few law schools that does. This limits access to an important field and keeps in place traditional barriers to diversifying academia.

The rankings methodology creates incentives to de-prioritize things we think are critical to our profession and role in society.

One of the most pernicious aspects of the US News rankings is its measure of per student expenditures. There is no evidence that this correlates to the quality of the education received. This works to the disadvantage of schools that have lower tuition and therefore lower per student expenditures.

US News discounts per student expenditures in some areas of the country by a cost-of-living adjustment that has nothing to do with educational quality. Again, I have complained to US News about this for years to no avail.

USNWR looks at student loan debt without appropriate context, creating incentives for law schools to admit high-income applicants (and those from high-income/high-wealth families) who can “afford to pay,” and will not take on much student loan debt. It also incentivizes the elimination of need-based aid. We have preserved a need-based aid program because we believe it is the right thing to do, but if we eliminated it we could certainly increase median LSAT scores and GPA by channeling all resources into recruitment of those students. This, we feel, is wrong – yet we understand why some schools do this, and the answer is because they fear to do otherwise will hurt their rankings.

Nothing about Berkeley Law is fundamentally changed by this decision. We will be the law school we’ve always been, and we will strive to improve – in accordance with our values. Now is a moment when law schools need to express to US News that they have created undesirable incentives for legal education. Accordingly, Berkeley Law will not participate in the US News survey this year.

#####What will be different moving forward?

I think this should be more of a discussion. No one really knows, certainly not me, so what do people think?

Hello,

I am working a full time job at Goldman Sachs. Just graduated from UNC-Chapel Hill in May 2024. I hope to apply to law school in the 2026 cycle.

Since I am 1-2 years out of school. Any tips on: A) Who to ask for letter of recommendation? B) How to ask them? C) How much leniency law schools will give me about my LORs given that I am years out of school?

Thanks!