Joint Degree Programs Anyone?

CurlyQQQ

I would love to do a joint degree program. Specifically I'd like to either obtain a J.D. M.P.P or J.D. PhD in government. What sucks is that I'll have to study for my GRE right after I take my LSAT (crap ) But anyway I wanted to see if anyone is thinking on a similar line? Is anyone else interested in joint degree programs? If so where? Also do you think it would aid in my wanting to delve into either International Relations or NGO or Immigration work (I wish there was a job that encompassed all three haha. I'm indecisive)? Are these joint degree programs a waste of time/money? Any and all thoughts welcome.

Tavorak_

I know a few joint degree programs accept the LSAT instead of making you take the GRE. The only one that I'm really interested in is Virginia's JD/MA in history. It's a three year program, costs nothing extra, and accepts the LSAT.

Alex

My thoughts are based off of a good amount of perusing law school related message boards, some books, and just knowing tons of attorneys where I work.

But, yeah, ultimately joint JD programs are usually pretty useless. The exceptions tend to be those who get them from top schools where the person was likely to succeed anyway. The biggest issue with these degrees is generally people who get joint degrees rarely use both. A JD is a professional degree to be a lawyer, and an MPP for public policy. And while both may compliment each other very nicely, both just aren't necessary for many of the jobs you'd likely be interested in. As a matter of fact, many would consider the JD a scarlet letter as it were. Denoting that perhaps the applicant "couldn't hack it as a lawyer" so they are looking for non-legal jobs. Employers also worry you may be a flight risk. Someone who will leave the job if a legal job comes your way. It is not uncommon to see people with law degrees rejected from starting positions at my job for this reason. They'd rather hire someone with a bachelors fresh out of college than someone with a JD/(whatever else degree) because not only can they pay them less, they don't have to worry about them leaving for a legal job opens up. It's a bit counter intuitive, but I can assure you, I've seen it happen too many times to be a coincidence.

That said, there are plenty of exceptions.

My best advice would be to look at the job qualifications people tend to have for the jobs you're after.

Rigid Designator

I can only speak from the perspective of someone who investigated joint PhDs with Philosophy, but my impression is that unless you are totally committed to leveraging the joint-degree in to an academic job (tenure-track for example), the extra investment vs. the added risk due to workload is not worth it. But don't let that put you off taking a deeper look. I imagine this question has many different answers within many different disciplines.

thisissparta

@"Alex Divine" said:
My thoughts are based off of a good amount of perusing law school related message boards, some books, and just knowing tons of attorneys where I work.

But, yeah, ultimately joint JD programs are usually pretty useless. The exceptions tend to be those who get them from top schools where the person was likely to succeed anyway. The biggest issue with these degrees is generally people who get joint degrees rarely use both. A JD is a professional degree to be a lawyer, and an MPP for public policy. And while both may compliment each other very nicely, both just aren't necessary for many of the jobs you'd likely be interested in. As a matter of fact, many would consider the JD a scarlet letter as it were. Denoting that perhaps the applicant "couldn't hack it as a lawyer" so they are looking for non-legal jobs. Employers also worry you may be a flight risk. Someone who will leave the job if a legal job comes your way. It is not uncommon to see people with law degrees rejected from starting positions at my job for this reason. They'd rather hire someone with a bachelors fresh out of college than someone with a JD/(whatever else degree) because not only can they pay them less, they don't have to worry about them leaving for a legal job opens up. It's a bit counter intuitive, but I can assure you, I've seen it happen too many times to be a coincidence.

That said, there are plenty of exceptions.

My best advice would be to look at the job qualifications people tend to have for the jobs you're after.

In Canada, I've heard the MPP and JD degrees are favorable in fields of labor law. Additionally, the joint degree it tends to favor an applicant positively if he/she applies to positions within a Ministry - especially the Ministry of Attorney General ( I think they explicitly state a preference for JD/MPP candidates). The claim is that it provides a student with a socio-political and legal perspective which governmental institutions can benefit from.

davidjamessutton1

I've applied to the JD/PhD programs at Columbia (Political Science) and NYU (Politics) because I want to practice law, teach law & political science, and research & write on American Politics. One of my current professors says if he could do it over again, he would have gotten a JD to go along with his PhD. I guess it depends on your career goals.

LastLSAT

A PhD might be worth it, but only if you have intentions to pursue an academic career (or if you wanted to get into patent prosecution as a hard science/engineering PhD, but that's a different story altogether). This especially holds true if the PhD programs you are looking into are funded, eg. they waive your tuition and give you a living stipend. Although, still not sure if it's worth delaying your career by the 4+ years that a PhD will tack on... that's entirely up to you!

Cant Get Right

The MPP at Penn will take LSAT, no GRE required. At Harvard, you can apply to Kennedy using your LSAT once you're attending law school, just not before. There's a lot of ways around the GRE, so just do your research and know your options at the schools you're most interested in.

PearsonSpecterLittUp

I'm really interested in the joint JD/MA at Georgetown, and they take LSAT in lieu of GRE

jagerbom79

I’m definitely planning JD/MBA if I can get into 3 yr program at t10. The advice given to me is it’s not worth it unless you know exactly why and usually that situation is when you are considering not practicing law after law school. The advice given to me with the MBA joint is that the MBA won’t make me a better practicing attorney. If you are on the fence of practicing law or working in consulting or a diff field but want to leverage a law degree I think that’s when the joint degree is more useful... or you are just interested in a broader education to understand the full picture in a particular niche service you wish to practice in. I think the decision to pursue or not pursue depends on individual needs/desires and the value-added it can provide. In sum, the joint degree won’t do much for you if you know you want to practice law unless the specialty you are interested in ...you have no experience in prior or on the fence of what you want to do in your career. If it isn’t another year of school and cost is marginal I am a huge proponent on education so I say go for it. Don’t worry about the increased workload. Chances are you are a student who can handle it. Hope this helps and makes sense haha. Wrote this quickly. Best of luck!

studyingandrestudying

Northwestern also has some good programs if you're interested.

wnivabyfdlj

I'm considering a joint J.D. and environmental justice M.S. program. Like @jagerbom79 said, I think both programs could be helpful if "you are on the fence of practicing law or working in consulting or a diff field but want to leverage a law degree I think that’s when the joint degree is more useful... or you are just interested in a broader education to understand the full picture in a particular niche service you wish to practice in."

Another reason to consider the joint degree program is that you can always change your mind in a year or two if you don't think you'll get what you need from either. Most of the M.S. programs I have looked into accept the LSAT in place of the GRE. (Too bad I took the GRE first.) This particular program, however, doesn't allow credits to count for the joint degree until you are accepted and enrolled in both schools. Then, you take two years of law school only classes before starting your M.S. So, while I am more drawn to the non profit world too, and the M.S. program is well-suited for that, if I don't apply to law school now, then I can't complete the duel degree later if I decide I'd like to be an attorney... At least not without a significant additional cost of both time and money. To me, it's worth a few bucks and some extra work now for that kind of flexibility later.

I see a lot of admin bios where the person has a law degree and/or worked as an attorney before entering the non profit world. So, I don't think it will hurt you, especially if you give yourself exposure to these types of organizations while in school and design your electives/free time around them.

I'd reach out to the schools and programs you're interested in and get recommendations straight from the source. There are surely students and professors with experience in making the most of your graduate school experience.

Good luck!