I’m taking the January test and in full swing of my PTs. What I’m finding is more recently, I’m getting easier questions wrong because my thought process is something like, “oh no, this question couldn’t possibly be this easy” or “what am I missing? This has to be a trick question.” And then I’m getting these easy questions wrong. Is there anything I can do to combat this?

Hey guys,

I tried to find JY’s post about which watches he recommends to no avail.

I’ve read a host of discussions, but still am not sure which one is the best choice and how to use it effectively?

Thank you in advance 😌

Hi guys,

I was wondering if you guys notice any interesting things about taking PT's and getting jumps in gains on the LSAT?

For example, was your improvement really gradual and incremental, or did it increase in leaps (occasionally with plateaus) after recognizing a certain thing or concept, or just reviewing why you missed certain questions? (i.e. 150 -> 152 -> 154 ->155 -> 158 , etc.)

Or ( 150 -> 152 ->158 -> 157 -> 164 -> 165, etc.)

For me, I noticed my score tend to increase in "leaps." Though I'm not sure if this is due to just starting and going through newbie gains, or actually starting to recognize patterns. (I feel like there can still be a huge improvement on my timing, and I'm trying my best!)

Just curious on how people got these improvement stories of stuff like 150 -> 162 -> 17X or, 162 -> 17X (how I did it, tales. For example, through incremental improvement, or just bounds of improvement and periods of plateau, then major improvement then stability again.)

Thanks!

Title says it all. I watched the post CC webinar and upgraded so I have access to everything now. I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed with the lack of structure and sheer amount of materials available now. For those who have been in a similar position, how did you proceed?

My question is whether I should learn the basics for all LR and Logic games and then proceed to attack the quizzes and tests with the Blind Review method? Or should I follow the core curriculum and not skip any parts?

Thank you!

how many questions are in test bank in total? I see Logical reasoning has 611 in total. Thinking of purchasing additional access to more if available.

Thanks!

I'm planning on using 36-50 and using PTs 60-72 for actual PTs. I might use PTs 50-59 for drills and purchase PTs 73-84 on Amazon. Please advise.

I suffer from anxiety and I find that when I am doing the PT I get very stressed and cannot write neatly / stay focused.

Do you have ay tips on how to stay calm during PTs?

My score changed 15 points from when I am timed and when I am not!!

I've been having a lovely discussion in another thread and I happen to be on a very strict time table that can't be altered so naturally the subject arises, to postpone, is that possible? Unfortunately I pretty much have to start in the fall of '19. Having started in October I'm taking the January LSAT and hoping I score high enough that a mediocre GPA with an excellent addendum and some exquisite personal statements and LORs and the moral purity of my intent will be enough to compensate for the lateness in the cycle. So naturally, maybe, but maybe I don't get admitted anywhere in the top 14. Then what?

I'd love to attend pretty much anywhere, though. I'm thinking T14 or bust because all of the information that can be found in a cursory search says a JD from essentially anywhere else may as well be your corpse, as our rarer monsters are, painted on a pole and underwrit, "Here may you see the effect of irrecoverable debt."

My desire for the T14 in this sense is entirely practical; prestige has no effect on me. Of course some of these places like Yale are dream places because of the rare opportunities they represent and how Harvard and Yale have a couple of the largest libraries on Earth. Yet the Socratic method works as well at any ABA school, does it not?

My grandfather was an attorney. For undergraduate he went to Columbia. For law school he went to Fordham, where he got his JD in 1950 at the age of 29. He went on to have a terrific career and life, and died a well loved old man. His command of conditional logic was a thing of divine elegance. However, 7sage says they're 29-37 on US News in the last few years. Could things really have changed so dramatically in only 68 years that I may as well not go to Fordham if admitted? Where would I find the data?

I mean, I figure, I'm legacy, they have a great location, my grandfather always spoke very highly of them and their requirements are marginally less strict than the T14. I don't doubt my ability to top my class at this point in life. Yet would this be to acquire a hopeless debt?

Where is the exact line past the T14? Seems like UCLA is sometimes 15. Being one below the T14 couldn't be a death sentence, could it? Also their admissions policy seem friendly to me for a variety of reasons. I'd prefer to be anywhere in Pennsylvania to North Carolina but Duke is 11 and PennState is 74! I mean, University of Pennsylvania, hope for a miracle, but, woof.

Hi Everyone! I finished 7sage CC at the end of Nov and took a post-CC diagnostic. I have been studying on and off for logic games proofing (only a few days worth) and have decided to push my Jan 2019 LSAT to March. I'm trying to figure out what I want to do between now and March but I'm kind of lost. My post-CC diagnostic is between 10-20 points from my goal score and I noticed that timing is an issue for me too. I have only taken 1 PT since the CC, tried to begin foolproofing, got tied up doing job interviews and I guess now I'm at square one again. However, I am ready to hit the ground running again and especially now that I am giving myself more time.

Q: Should I take a few more PTs now to determine where I'm at curriculum-wise before jumping into logic game proofing or just go right into LG proofing?

With a little more time, I can take more PTs before the real deal but I'm not going to have time to commit to a robust logic games proofing schedule (section a day, Pacifico's method, one whole month).

Q: Is it possible to get the benefits of foolproofing from just doing the logic games from the PTs I take? JY's or Pacifico's Method?

I also start taking classes at the beginnng of January, have a two-week sping break in March and the week after that I have the exam. I made sure that my schedule wasnt going to be to rigorous to make time for the LSAT but I see these three months as my "PT and rigourous BR" phase of my studying (1-2 test per week for 12 weeks). My post-CC diagnostic was pretty average but it may or not be the best indication for where I am right now (those were the first and only-timed sections/questions I've done since I started 7Sage).

Q: Is more or less PTs in my situation better? Timing is an issue for me, but it's not like I scored a 180 on the BR of that post-CC PT.

So what's the best course of action I should take? I plan to reboot my LSAT studying on Sunday (Dec. 23).

P.S. I had a chance to checkout the Post-CC webinar and that was pretty helpful too but wondering if anyone has any advice to drive home, add or tweak from what was advised.

As you probably know, the LSAT measures your logical ability, reading comprehension, and mental acuity. Perhaps just as importantly, though, it also tests your confidence, fortitude, and ability to handle stress. I’m going to talk about the latter, because focusing on these made a world of difference for me.

I started studying off and on for the LSAT from about February to May and I was getting about mid-to-high150’s in a couple of PT’s. I started to study seriously in May, and thanks largely to 7Sage I moved into the 168-170 range on my PT’s by September! This range was my goal, and so I took the September test hoping that I could match my PT’s and start applying by October. Unfortunately, though, I got a 165. This was still a fine score, but I didn’t understand why I had underperformed. The more I thought about it, the more realized that it had more to do with how I prepared for the test than how I had studied for it if that makes sense. I made some significant changes, and in November I got a 169!

Those four points have COMPLETELY changed my application outlook. At best, I had a fair-to-middling chance at getting in to a T14 school before, with a T20 school being more likely. That would have been great, but now I have a decent chance at a T6 school! (I should note that I’m a former Air Force officer with a masters and some other strong soft factors.) The thing that might surprise you, though, is that from September to November I did almost no studying. The only thing I did was take two PT’s in the week before the test to shake off any rust that might have developed. Below is a list of what I did do.

To be fair, 7Sage says a lot of this in one of its early lessons, but I think my example is a good anecdotal case study of the importance of the intangible factors. Feel free to use or not use any of the things I did, because in the end it all comes down to your specific experience and how your individual brain will respond. I'm probably an extreme case to be honest, so you should probably tone some of these things down a bit if you do use them. Bottom line, the important thing is that you do everything you can to create the best circumstances for success. Good luck!

P.S. I just used the Edit Once sentence-level edit feature in the Admissions course, and it might be the best $200 I ever spent. I definitely recommend it for peace of mind before you send off your applications if you are at that point.

I am thinking of seating for the June 2019 Exam. Does anyone has taken the exam in Georgetown or Albany? If yes, how was your experience at these centers.

So the July 2018 non disclosed test was the February 2014 LSAT. The February 2018 test was the February 2016 test.

So it seems like nondisdisclosed test are around 2/3/4 years older than when they are given. So for the upcoming January 2019 non disclosed test, should we be focusing/prioritizing on PT's in the 2015/2016 range? This would be PT's in the mid to late 70s?

Should we do this as opposed to focus on the very most recent exams (mid 80s)?

(Let's assume we have 5 weeks left to the January test, and we're trying to choose which 5 PT's we are planning to take - mid 70s or mid 80s).

I've heard the more recent PT's have changed. Though I haven't taken PT's from 74-86, so I can't really speak about the more recent changes. Can someone explain the differences between PT's in the early 70s to PT's in the mid 80s?

Is there a big difference btw PT's in the mid to late 70s and PT's in the mid 80s?

If there is a difference, should focus more on PT's in the 70s, since that is what is more likely to be represented on a non disclosed test?

Also, it seems like non disclosed test seem to have had a pattern of kinda weird games. Should we be more intentional in practicing those?

any advice or suggestions would be appreciated. thank you.

Would love any feedback from the most wise and experienced @NotMyName and @"Cant Get Right" !! thank you!!

Hi All!

I’m planning to take the January test. I’ve already postponed several times (I’ve been postponing since June) and want to finally get it over with. I’ve been studying consistently for quite a while and have jumped from a 148 to 165+. My goal is 170+ and I think I still have room for improvement (especially because I just recently started properly BR-ing everything, even doing written explanations for my thought process). I’ll be graduating from a top 10 undergrad (with a 3.94 GPA) in May and then plan to take a gap year to work and apply to law school next cycle during my gap year. I went through the 7sage curriculum but also did Powerscore Bible stuff, had a tutor, and took a class. I’ve been doing lots of drills and now have recently moved on to individual timed sections. On the sections, I’ve averaging -0/-1 on LG, -2/-3 on RC, and -4/-5 on LR. I think that’s pretty good and am able to focus quite well during individual sections. However, whenever I have to take a practice test, I freak out. I find any excuse to postpone it and then when I actually sit down to do it, I feel incredibly anxious and unmotivated. I’m trying to do 6 section practice exams now in order to build up endurance, but I’m not sure if that’s the right approach. Maybe I’m just burnt out...any thoughts or advice? Similar experiences? Should I take the March test? Thank you!!

Hi fam and happy holidays to those celebrating!

I had a quick notation question if that's alright? So coming from a formal logic background and Powerscore tutoring, I was always told to notate an "and" statement like so:

..........B

A→ +

..........C

However, while I was foolproofing the Logic Games from PT 70 I came across J.Y's method/style:

A→B

↘ C

I do remember this notation from my 7 sage days years ago and more recently from some lessons upon my return, so I tried it. No surprise, it made the game infinitely easier (Game 2 for reference).

My question is this: Are there situations where one style is better than the other and if so what are they?

Thanks for your time!

Salutations!

So when I first saw the pencil threads here and at TLS my impression was that they were jokes entirely. But as a result of them I did notice that the videos of folks trying the logic games here do show an expensive pencil, they say Staedtler Wopex on them and I happen to have heard of that brand. In contrast all the pencils I have here do not have a brand that I've heard of because they were less than ten cents each, and not being a graphite artist or technical sketcher I've never had a reason to have quality graphite.

So, it did make me curious, does 7sage just happen to have oddly artistic grade pencils around or does a high quality pencil actually give you a bit of precious extra time on bubbling? I asked 7sage directly but the staffer there said to ask here, and encouraged me to become socially involved here as well.

I'm taking the January '19 LSAT incidentally so it will still be scantron. This is incidentally the only one I can take, postponement is impossible. I've had only the three months before to prepare and I just have 7sage starter. I wish I could postpone but I was displaced from my industry and home in California wine country by the Tubbs and Atlas Fires. I've been living with my parents and fiance since, trying to find a new, less flammable career. It only occurred to me in mid-October, my grandfather was an attorney, how might I do on the LSAT? So I took a practice test to see how I might do. Although my overall score was only 160 I did get -0 RC, and I really loved taking the exam, so I've been crunching 7sage videos at 2.4x and logic games ever since. I've never had any previous exposure to conditional logic, except, as I realised in retrospect, in my grandfather's sense of humor. Learning it since has been one of my greatest pleasures thus far. I've always been rather good at argumentation but conditional logic is a whole other level of perception, my experience of the universe has been altered irrevocably.

After noticing I was still confused (thank you Eliezer Yudkowsky) about certain principles of the examination in spite of having covered all of the materials on Khan Academy I tried the free trial here. When JY Ping in his description of the Blind Review said "[. . .] Your aim is true understanding [. . .]" I became enraptured in the curriculum and immediately purchased the Starter package, the most I could afford. This in combination with 7sage's assertion that law school is a more difficult challenge than the LSAT itself has had me exhilarated. Sharpen my mind, O grind stone! Rend confusion from the fat of my brain, O great Socratic axemen!

But yes, unfortunately I simply must begin in the fall of '19 regardless of how it goes. My situation cannot wait. I'm doing logic games over and over again as prescribed by 7sage's Fool-Proof Guide to Perfection and noticing rapid improvement. After the New Year I'll just be doing as many Practice Tests as I can before the 26th without experiencing diminishing returns and fatigue, on this point I'm sure I can do more than average for a variety of reasons each of which are matters of protracted discussion. Then I'll just see how it goes.

I worked 12 hours a day 6 days a week at a winery in Napa and I've been studying that way since mid-November, but I've been crunching the fundamentals and the games. I haven't taken a new practice test to see how 7sage has helped me yet. I can't wait, though.

Existentially anxious, though! Since yeah, it's Fall '19 or bust and T14 or bust. I mean, I'll be applying to some safety schools since my overall undergraduate GPA was 3.15. Though my average for the last two years of it is way better, I struggled with severe depression and other health and mental health issues associated with an utter lack of structure in childhood, something I've made dramatic strides in since. I graduated in 2012 though and my work experience since then is a wild ride of exotic types of labor, so, hopefully that'll matter less especially if I can pull off a 173-180. Also as a school of theater some of the grades were entirely subjective. I'm hoping if I really ace the LSAT and write an interesting enough application I can sway Yale, but then of course there's the probability I won't get in anywhere in the T14. I know if I had done any college lately I'd have a 4.0 but, I haven't.

Although, as to how far down past the T14 one can go and still not be indebted to an unemployable degree, I don't exactly know. I'd love to know more about this since, obviously a safer range of schools and a wider variety of places to live is better.

One thing that might help my situation is my intent, I noticed a few schools have debt forgiveness for people working in human rights or the public sector. My fiance grew up in poverty and really knows how to live well on a limited budget and neither of us have any special material needs. In fact we've at times roamed penniless between agricultural volunteer opportunities in the most rugged conceivable conditions. I can trod through several feet of livestock effluent with a hay bale on my back so I can certainly make a modest salary.

So I may certainly be interested in something like that, the only difficulty there is that my basic intent is to do the greatest possible moral good I may, like anyone, and not having a great familiarity with the industry of law such as it is constituted presently, I don't necessarily know which parts of the field that is. International human rights sounds like it'd involve a lot of moral good but I don't know that. It attracts my interest because human rights violations internationally is one of the primary focuses of my vocational reading. I'm revolted by the great number and frequency of them, and especially how many of them are directly caused by the United States government, regardless of who is in charge. As to what I can do about that with a JD from one of many schools each of which educated several politicians, some of whom are directly responsible for much of these moral horrors is, unclear. So far I only know I love the process.

I don't know how this ended up sprawling so much, sorry. I should probably get back to logic games. Incidentally I notice a lot of people saying "Fool-proofing" as a verb, I think because of the document "Fool-proof Guide to Perfection on Logic Games." Interesting that it developed that way. The language instinct is fascinating.

Oh, random thing! I had a previous thread about my confusion with "or." As someone very language oriented I had always understood or as biconditionally exclusive and it was screwing me up. I've since found it helps to think that "or" in natural language is not generally equivalent to the inclusive disjunction A ∨ B in formal logic, but that on the LSAT, it is.

Due to popular demand, Sage @NotMyName will be offering office hours on Thursday! Bring your questions!

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Hey everyone, so I've gotten out the bulk of my applications but I still want to submit more. I'm honestly just waiting on my next few paychecks. It's difficult to afford all these applications especially during the holidays. So would applying late December early January put me at a disadvantage? Should I just put the rest of my apps on a credit card? Please let me know if I should be submitting my apps asap.

Hello,

My name is Alec. I started studying for the LSAT in early November 2018 on a full time basis. My diagnostic score was a 150. After a month and a half of studying (CC completed and 4 PTs) I have raised my average to ~161. I am debating whether to sit for the January LSAT or wait a cycle and take it this march or this summer. I graduated with a 4.0 gpa with a degree in philosophy. Any advice or input would be appreciated. My gut tells me that it would be in my best interest to slow things down, get the best possible LSAT score when I'm ready, and apply early next fall. However, it's hard to know how much improvement can be expected in another 5-6 weeks.

Yours,

Alec

I don’t see it anyone under the logic games tab. Not sure if my iPad is funky, if I should redownload or if 7Sage just doesn’t update the app for working functionality...

Hey everyone, I was wondering what my chances at the T-14 are? I also don't mind going to a tier 2 school on scholarship. Also would shooting for a school ranked from 20-30 be more beneficial than attending a regional school where I know I want to work. I see people putting so much emphasis on schools in the T25 or T30, but I don't mind going to a school ranked in the 50's that's in the state I want to work. I want to stay in the NY/NJ/(maybe PA) area. Outside of the T-14 there aren't many decently ranked schools in this area. Any suggestions on schools I should be applying too? I also want to apply to schools that will give me nearly a full ride.

I've prepared lsat for two months, i studied all the 7sage courses, some of the trainer courses. But i still couldn't see any improvement on my test score. I was stuck under 150 in my recent timed 4 PT. Without time limit, my PT score is between 155-160. My friend suggest me to take 1 PT everyday and review it. I can do that, but i couldn't see any improvement if keep doing so.

LR is my frustrated part. I watched all the course and thought i can improve a lot. But the truth is I can only get 8-13 right of each LR section. Meanwhile i will left 5-6 questions unfinished and even not read. So, the skip strategy almost doesn't applies to me. Since no matter how i skip, i still couldn't finish the questions. Most of the time, when i read the stimulus, i need to refer back to former sentences over and over again to understand the stimulus. It costs me a lot of time. Blind review is also let me angry. First, there always five choices i haven't review and to be wrong. Second even when i reviewed the questions, there're still 3-5 my reviewed answer choice still be wrong. I can understand all the explanations through video or discussion forum. But next time, i still be wrong which make me hopeless.

RC is frustrated as well. Sometimes, i can get 12-14 right this section with a whole passage left unread. In the beginning, i tried to read and whole passage before answering the questions, but it usually take 8 minutes to read each passage and turn out to be a lower correction rate. Now, i skip all the details only read the core sentences, it takes less time, but i still cannot finish the last passages.

Game is bit less than the other two sections. I can get 15-21 right in this section. There's no game i cannot solve after i watched the video. However, there are three big problems. First, i can solve doesn't mean i won't stuck. I stuck a lot on most of the games.

Second, i habitually misread or interpret the stimulus and choose the wrong answers. As a result, i miss 3-4 questions every section in this way. Third, when i try to slow down and make sure my understanding is right, i spent a lot of time and only deduct the wrong questions down to 2-3 of each section. And the result is i may not have time to proceed the last game.

Another problem is i have little sense of the time. Sometimes i feel i was fast, and only stuck a little. The truth is I'm too slow. Anyone can help me a little more about any of the question i met. I'm not clever, but i'm very diligent. And i only aim 150 for the time being.

i've been trying to "foolproof" RC and LR basically - maybe after a week of doing a LR and RC section, redoing those sections again timed. And in 2nd time doing it, really focusing on form, and being conscious of breaking the old thinking habits on questions I got wrong before and trying to reinforce good thinking habits.

Anyone else try this or have any suggesions on this? any comments or suggestions appreciated.

foolproofing RC and LR also helps me to gain a deeper insight into that LR/RC section, where I am able to see patterns, cookie cutter wrong AC's, logic structures, etc. in a way that I did not see when I first took it. Thus doing this reinforces a deeper understanding of the patterns of the LSAT.

Foolrpoofing RC and LR is also helpful because if I get a question wrong again, it'll show me that my original BR/review was not sufficient, and will force me to go deeper.

Hey everyone, I'm wondering what is grammatically correct. I know for ex. Fall 2017 would be capitalized. However would "In the fall of 2017" be capitalized as well?

I am wondering if anyone knows what LSAC will report to schools that take an average of your LSAT scores. The University of Alberta takes an average of all your exams, so I'm wondering if LSAC will round it up if your score averages out to something like ___.667.