Hey All,

72 days left for all of my fellow September LSAT takers! Definitely beginning to feel that tinge of pressure. The end is in sight :)

I'm seeking advice from any sages/top scorers who routinely score in the 170s. A few top scorers that I've had the pleasure of speaking to had an average PT score of 173, 174, 175, etc. I'm wondering how you all were able to overcome the "almost there but not quite in the 98/99th percentile" plateau. My last 5 scores were 168, 174 (yay), 169, 168, and 169, respectively, so I'm averaging at 169.6. I'm prepping the same way I have been for my entire LSAT career, but I feel as though I cannot get over this 169 phase. Any tips from those who have been here?

RC is definitely still the primary cause of this plateau. Averaging -7 for RC, -1 for LG, and -2 for LG.

Thanks in advance!

Hi all, I am currently going through the CC, specifically the weakening questions. I have found that in many of these questions, identifying the conclusion seems pretty straightforward (thus, therefore), and even at the end of the paragraph. However, I keep thinking of MP and MSS questions, where conclusion indicators at the end are often traps for a sub-conclusion. What are your experiences with conclusion indicator traps? Do they typically just apply to MSS and MP, or should I continue to look for them, even in weakening and other LR questions?

Hi everyone! Happy Grey Day! Just received my score and didn't do so hot, not horrible but I want to improve by 10 points at least. I'm going to upgrade my account and purchase a course, but I was looking for help on which one to choose. I'm kind of broke at the moment and can afford the Ultimate package, or the premium package. I see little differences between the two, should I get the Ultimate at the $549 price point or would it be wiser to save some money for not much of a difference in resources with the premium package? Looking for some opinions from my fellow sagers.

Thanks everyone!

Jon

Does anyone have an educated guess as to what the curve possibly could be?

I took PT 66 RC a week ago and got -16. Without BRing for it I retook it just now and ended up with -13. Not much difference! I had to skip the last passage AGAIN and got stuck between 2 answer choices in 10 questions. The ACs were much harder to eliminate and I felt I was in a foreign land of RC. I felt so lost and confused throughout the proces. I wanted to test whether it was a major burnout or RC got significantly harder for me and unfortunately it was the latter. In PT 62 I had a similar experience with -16. I scored -7 (PT65), -5(PT64), -9 (PT63) but WTH went wrong with those two...? I'm wondering if anyone had a similar experience... I am scared of taking PT 67 to experience another FALL. Really hoping this RC was harder for a lot of people. Any advice on how to BR this PT RIGHT would be much appreciated. HELP ME.

What do you guys feel are the implications of the self-perceived confidence of a test taker when they take a test? Have you ever been really confident in your performance on a PT only to find that you've bombed multiple sections? Have you ever felt bad about a PT and discovered afterwards that you over-performed?

Personally I've experienced a bit of both extremes throughout my preparation, but I find I've done my best work when I'm slightly pessimistic about my performance. I think this happens because my logical faculties are in overdrive on a PT when I'm not exactly certain on any given number of questions (i.e. when I've narrowed my options to two answer choices on an LR/RC question), and so I'm forced to give the proper justification before selecting my answer. This attitude seems to indicate more correct answers than when I'm overconfident and feel I've nailed a test.

I ask because I tend to think mindset, whether it's overconfidence or self-loathing, can be a major problem for some test takers, especially as they approach the end of their respective journeys. I also think the whole 'mindset' discussion is underrepresented when it comes to talk of LSAT preparation.

So, what do you all think? What are your experiences with your levels of confidence?

As a departing veteran - my captain or senior in rank wrote work evals on myself that distinguished my performance against peers on a ship / unit and against the Navy as a whole - shall I include those write-ups somehow in my admissions package? Additional materials mailed to the law school?

Hi everyone! So I am studying through some PTs now and using the blind review method, find that I can figure out exactly why an answer was correct in place of the answer I chose upon reviewing but haven't been able to translate that into behaviour or habits or pinpoint exactly why I chose the wrong one (I know but on the scale of that question) but there is no overarching pattern of me choosing the wrong answers for any one particular reason. Is anyone else having this problem and how did you delve into this? Is it just a matter of repetition?

Hey Everyone,

I signed up for the September LSAT about a month ago, but have yet to receive a package in the mail with all the info on what to bring, where to go etc.

I'm not sure if this is something that gets sent closer to test day? If anyone that has taken the test has any insight I'd appreciate it. I just want to make sure it didn't get lost in the mail.

Thanks

I just took my first timed PT after foolproofing and the CC so i got a 160 timed and a 171 on the BR. This is way below what i was expecting. Could it be that i scored much lower bc it was my first timed PT. Should i expect a jump in scores just based on adjusting to taking timed tests?

In my drills (20's to 30's), I score -3/-4 for easier sections and -1/-2 for harder sections. What does this mean and has this happened to any of you? How do I overcome this?

I feel like I'm in a sort of awkward spot during my studies. I saw an improvement and am now at a new plateau. However, where I use to be confident in my methods for fixing my weaknesses, now I can't figure out how to approach the test.

Admitiadly I haven't spent much time on RC, and it is a major impact on my score (up to -8) this section is a hit or miss. There are also times I go -2 but then my LR shoots up through the roof.

I still don't feel completely confident in my LR either.

I seem to be missing the "hardest" questions per LR section. These could be any question type, but they are the most difficult to solve. So whereas before I would attack the questions by type, now I feel lost.

When I review the questions I've missed though I almost always spot the correct answer, and don't know why I ever picked the answer I did. Very rarely do I go back to a question and continue to struggle.

I also can't seem to polish off LG. I'm always going -1 to -2. I finish with extra time fairly often, and feel confident in my answers. Some how they always manage to get me with one.

I feel like I'm trying to sweep a path at the beach. Every time I clear a spot the sand gets blown right back onto it!

Any suggestions?

Sharing this in hopes that it might be useful to some:

In an effort to feel more comfortable with "mathy" questions (involving proportions, percentages, averages...), I searched the discussion forum for a list of such questions and it seems that only @dannyshaw had looked for something similar.

I quickly realized that there were lots of them, at least 4-5 questions in each PT. I found them by searching "proportions", "percent", or "average" in my digital PTs. Does anyone have any suggestions of what other keywords to search? I can also come up with "number", "incidence", and "prevalence", but those don't seem to come up as frequently.

Has anyone else drilled these types of questions? Is it more useful to read something like How to Lie with Statistics than drill?

These are several "mathy" questions I found just in PTs 1 and 2.

PT01.S3.Q11 - proportion

PT01.S3.Q21 - proportion

PT01.S3.Q12 - average

PT01.S4.Q04 - percent

PT02.S2.Q04 - average

PT02.S2.Q14 - average

PT02.S2.Q16-17 - percent

PT02.S4.Q05 - proportion

PT02.S4.Q15 - percent

Cheers!

Hey Everyone,

As promised I am starting the free LR tutoring. The first session will be on July 9th at 3 pm (eastern time).

The goal of these sessions is to go over one cookie cutter argument type each week. A cookie cutter argument is an argument that logically repeats on each test. The LSAT writers use different subject matter or grammar or both to disguise their logical shape in the stimulus and make it difficult for us. Sometimes they even have more than one cookie cutter argument in the stimulus. But the logic works pretty much the same way. Recognizing these patterns and knowing how the answers might shape up according to the question type is what helps gives us speed on LSAT.

The first session will be conducted on conditional logic. This is, in my opinion, one of the easier patterns to grasp. This would allow us to go over what cookie cutter arguments are and how conditional logic patterns appear throughout different question types. This will also give me a good idea of how to improve the next sessions.

After that, I have the next three session also ready to go. I am hoping to do each week a new session. The second one is on causal arguments, followed by Phenomena Hypothesis, and then Partial information ( I made up this name). These are the main ones and in my opinion occur most frequently on test. Depending on how these sessions go, I can work on doing the other patterns as well or we could stop there.

There is no minimum or maximum number of people. I welcome everybody. The questions will be made available on the screens for all to see so you don't have to bring in anything. I will be pulling questions from the older practice tests, PT 30-39. So this will not ruin fresh PT's for anyone as these tests are mainly used for drilling. However, you will get more out of these sessions if you have done the core curriculum. This will help you add on to the information you already know and you do need to know the basics of how conditional arguments work as well as what it means to strengthen/weaken, find the flaw, and see what must be true.

I am actually really excited to see how this shapes up and I hope this will be helpful to all of you. Preparing for these sessions from scratch was actually a lot of work so I am hoping this helps a lot of you out.

To join, please follow the link at the specified date and time. I will see you all there. (3(/p)

Free LR Tutoring (Sami)

Please join my meeting from your computer, tablet or smartphone.

https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/589887541

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So i see that some LR Qs will say if .A. it is likely that .B.

Is this conditional?

Hi all,

I've posted about my RC struggles a few times now so I'm few several of you are familiar with my predicament. I have very strong scores in LG and LR, but my RC score is average at best. About -10 give or take on timed sections. I guess that's average because that down 4 sections would be about a 150...but I'm not sure of the actual average RC score.

I've tried all of the methods available to me. I've practiced, practiced, and practiced some more and with no progress. In fact, a few times I've thought that I've sort of figured it out with a -3/-4 section only to find out I was still in the -9/-11 range. That's the most frustrating thing of all.

Obviously, retaining every detail of the passage is impossible. I just seem to fall prey to trap answers left and right in RC. It demands a superb short term memory and I exercise that in games and LR...I just don't know why it doesn't translate to RC. Has anyone else faced this sort of problem? How did you 'figure it out'?

My two biggest problems are definitely falling prey to trap answers and having to look back at the passage when it shouldn't be necessary which slows me down. Because of this, I usually end up not reading the last two passages very well. Ironically, my scores on the last two passages are not any worse than on the first two when I put more time in...just another maddening piece of information.

I don't know if I need an entire RC makeover or what...but I'm just practicing and feel like I'm getting no where.

Any tricks or tips from people who were in my situation would be greatly appreciated. Again, 170+ range scores in LG and LR, 150 range score in RC.

Hey all!

Just wanted to see what others who are attempting to take the September test are studying right now..what's your study plan until the test date? I just went through the core curriculum,drilling Logic Games right now. Trying to figure out practice tests schedule right now. I'm studying full time until the test date so trying to figure out how to maximize my potential.

JY talks about how these are freebies but i am really struggling with them. And i dont think its an issue in my understanding of logic

Hey! Can someone please help me with this one I'm really not sure why A is the right answer. It's funny when I took this test I got this question right (circled it because wasn't sure) but now not clear why it's right. Thanks so much!

http://classic.7sage.com/lsat_explanations/lsat-74-section-1-question-17/

Hi, I BR-ed this question, read the explanations from various websites and sources, and this question is still not making much sense to me.

The correct choice D has "probably" in it, which when negated is "not likely." Doesn't "not likely" still leave room for the support in the stimulus to stand? I know that it weakens the support, but is merely weakening it the same as being "necessary?"

If the AC had the word "some" instead of "probably," I would have chosen D in a heartbeat.

If negating the assumption still renders the support possible, I am wondering what makes it "necessary."

How is this AC different from, for example,

Stimulus: Kofi is a cat. Therefore, she is happy.

Here, an assumption "all cats are happy" would be an SA, but not a NA, because even if we were to negate "all cats are happy," we are left with "some cats are happy," which still makes the support plausible.

Here's my guess at the difference, but please critique me:

15 is directly targeting the author's interpretation (the conditional statement directly applies to the author's interpretation in this case)

However, in the above cat example, we wouldn't know if the particular cat "Kofi" would belong to the "some cats" group and therefore the effect of the negated assumption is unclear & doesn't weaken?

If that is the case, if answer choice D were to be worded as "Behaviors common to people of widely disparate culture probably have genetic predisposition to those behaviors" also be necessary? why or why not?

I would really appreciate any advice!

https://classic.7sage.com/lsat_explanations/lsat-68-section-2-question-15/

Hey everyone! Hope your LSAT studies are going well.

I am currently in the process of fool-proof drilling logic games (on PT 15), and usually set a timer upwards. Yet, I realize that I tend to go way over time for many of the games.

My question is should I start timing myself downwards using the suggested time as a limit. Or would it be better to keep timing myself upwards to see my natural pace.

Thank you.

I'm thinking it is time to switch up the way I'm doing timed sections. Right now I have my phone stop watch run and pay 0 attention to it. I stop it when I get to the end of my section, record my time and move on.

I think it's time to go analog. I'm not sure if I'll even want a physical watch on test day, but it cannot hurt to train with one. That being said I'm looking for suggestions.

The 180 watch seems pricey but does seem to fit the LSAT very well.

There is also the Perfect Score watch but Amazon has mixed reviews on it.

What do you guys use to time yourself with. What are the pros/cons?

I've been taking practice tests starting with the earlier ones from the 1990s. I've been scoring pretty well on them (high 160s-low 170s). Are they easier than more current tests? Is my average score an accurate picture of where I would be if I took the LSAT right now?

Hey was just curious how others approach the prep tests. Do you diligently do the prep tests in order, or do you tend to jump around from 50s to 70s to 20s etc?

Just curious if there is a better strategy. I've been going pretty diligently in order from prep test 37, and I'm now in the 50s but also kind of want to just tackle test 80 for a thrill and to see how different it is. Is this a bad idea? Should I leave the later exams for closer to test day?

Hey everyone, not sure if I'm just blind, but I just did the early prep test 1 logic games section and can't find the answers anywhere. I just upgraded to the Ultimate+ package so it should have answers, no?