As many of you have noticed, 7Sage was down for a few hours. If this impacted your studying, please accept our apology. Email us (studentservice@7sage.com) and we’ll extend your access by a month. It doesn’t exactly make up but we are sorry about this.

Is there any information I can glean from this language. Is it truly neutral? Just saw this on a status checker. Thanks.

I find that I am taking longer than the amount of time suggested on the course for each lesson, with getting each problem set done. Right now, I try to go through each set timed, go back through to blind review and watch the explanation. I am wondering if I am not using my time productively, given that I will take the test in June.

Looking for some advice and general thoughts from others who may be considering a retake. I just took the LSAT for the 2nd time in January and scored a 168. This was a 4 point improvement from my first try in September and I am fairly happy with it but I really wanted to break the 170 mark especially since my PT average was right around that so I know I can do it. I currently work full time and have one year left in a 2 year rotational analyst program with a bank so I plan on applying early next cycle. Since I have all this time I feel like I should keep grinding and give it a 3rd go for the 170 in the summer. However, I am worried about doing worse. I know law schools only need to report the highest score but I still feel like regressing on a 3rd attempt would look bad. I have also burned through most recent PTs and am not exactly sure how to go forward.

Has Berkeley selected the Finalist for the Opportunity Scholarship ?

Hello,

I've been out of the loop for the past couple of months (a lot happened).

Here's my situation:

Accepted to 1

WL 2

Rejected about 4 - 5 other places

I have begun studying for the Sept 2019 LSAT (possibly July if progress is faster).

My plan is to use the LSAT trainer first, Powerscore Bibles, and also 7sage for drills and exams.

I really hope pushing a year will make a difference (I honestly will not have any updates on my resume between that time).

My real question is,

Can I re-apply to the schools I was rejected from with the SAME LOR and PS/opt essays?

Will that look poor on my part if the only difference in my application is my LSAT score between a whole year?

Any support and advice is always welcomed, and also looking to hear from any re-applicants!

Back to studying I go...

So I've been memorizing all the logical indicators that were taught during the logic lessons and had a question.

In the Sufficient & Necessary Condition Cheatsheet it lists out all the main indicators.

For example, in Group 1, the lists says: any, all, every, if, the only, when, where, anyone, whenever.

This got me thinking, if 'any' & 'anyone', 'when' & 'whenever' are all indicators for a sufficient condition.

Could 'wherever' also be an indicator for a sufficient condition seeing how 'where' is already part of the list?

I know JY points out that his list of the indicators isn't a full comprehensive list, I but wanted to make sure words like 'wherever' weren't omitted for a reason.

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Hi everyone! I'm looking for some good "sage" advice as to the best ways to prepare for the september exam. I've resourced the powerscore LG bible, the LSAT trainer by Mike Kim and I've worked my way through the free trial on here. I'm going to register for one of the courses, but I'm not yet sure which one is going to benefit me the best as im torn between the premium and the ultimate.

My question is this, what techniques have you guys used to initially start off that proved to increase your score? AND do you guys recommend just taking a cold PT untimed to see where your at? I keep reading about people timing their first test just to see where they're at but I'm not sure if thats the best route?

Any advice you guys could share would be greatly appreciated as I'm really looking to score relatively high. ( like everyone else LOL) #goals

Hey! So as I’m pushing through my second semester at NU I thought I’d come back and share a little bit about my experience with an extremely late acceptance of a waitlist and what it’s like being on like 12 waitlists with 0 acceptances. Hopefully some of this will help those who are on waitlists and feel as lost and confused as I did.

BACKGROUND FOLLOWS SKIP FOR MY EXPERIENCE:

My story: I was a splitter - last December I scored a 171 on the December LSAT, coupled with a 2.83 cumulative GPA, I was ready to apply to schools and get rejected like crazy. What I wasn’t anticipating was getting waitlisted at half of the T-14 and some other t-20 schools.

My apps were submitted by late January and in March the waitlist began rolling in. Duke, Pen, UCLA, NU, ND, Mich, Irvine...etc etc.

I was getting waitlisted more than rejected. However I ended up in a situation where I was waitlisted everywhere and accepted nowhere.

I played the game throughout spring and summer. I sent LOCI’s every month or two and generally kept on top of them.

Starting in June I started falling off waitlist. This went on until late July, at which point NU was the only outstanding waitlist - and I had just accepted defeat. I got a second job was ready to figure out my life, then NU called - offered me a spot - and like a child at Disneyland I tearfully and excitedly accepted. The only issue? Classes started in 4 days, I was in California and I had to get out to Chicago as fast as possible.

BEGIN HERE FOR MY EXPERIENCE:

When I got to Chicago I didn’t have a place to live. The school got me a hotel for a week but after that it was on me. So basically my first week of law school, when I wanted to be focused on classes, I was dealing with apartment hunting. This really got me off on the wrong foot - was behind in readings and never caught up.

I also missed orientation week - which meant I wasn’t on most of the email lists. For the first month I missed many important lunch meetings and seminars. I didn’t even know they were a thing, and since I hadn’t made any friends/Aquintances I was lost. This never went away, even today. I still feel like I’m not a working gear in the NU clock. This is something you want to address right away. I also had to get ID’s made, full out paperwork, deal with school medical stuff....it was a lot in a small timeframe

Moving without housing: huge issue. My first month was spent more on trying to get a place to live, a bed, and everything else you need to live than it was on class work. I flew out with one suitcase of stuff. Trying to deal with this and law school is not for the faint of heart.

People already know each other and you’ll feel left out. People have been taking since orientation - if you weren’t lucky enough to make it to that you’ll be that one guy/gal that is on the outside. It will eventually go away (not the social awkwardness -that stays - law school is weird man) and you’ll start to make friends.

So if you are on the waitlist and thinking of making a split second decision - be prepared to potentially be way behind the curve from the get go. Work diligently and prioritize; but definitely take these things into consideration when you are weighing your options with the waitlists.

So got my January score. I knew I bombed the LG section. I was prepared to think I'd failed miserably then. I got my score just now and I got one point lower than my November...so while bad, at least not as horrific as I was preparing myself for.

How badly will this affect me now that I have already applied?? I was doing this to see if I did better, to try negotiating for more money, if any is even offered....so no that's out the window. Do I do March anyway to see??

I'm wondering if I should upgrade to Ultimate+. Here's my dilemma:

I have PDF's of each question type (with questions from PT 1-35) and they're arranged by difficulty from a previous tutor which is super convenient. The only thing is that I find it extremely helpful to be able to go back and watch J.Y's videos after BR or if I'm having difficulty with a question. Also, I find it hard to organize/make my own 'problem sets'. I feel like I just have multiple running lists of problem types I should be doing with different difficulties but have trouble keeping track of them. I should also mention that I have every PT from 39+ available as well for when I start PTing.

Is it worth it to spend the extra money to upgrade to Ultimate+ given my circumstances?

If I were to upgrade to Ultimate+, how should I go about doing the problem sets? Do you do all of them after each lesson or save the harder ones for later/review?

Hi there!

What do you guys review or study when you're not exactly focused and just hanging out? Any flashcards or anything? I was thinking about making some flash cards for various question stems. Curious to see what others do when they're not "in the zone" but still trying to be productive.

@keets993 @eRetaker

I'm writing this because I promised to and because the internet has a sort of strong response bias where only those who do well to report back on their experience.

I ended up with a B in Civil Procedure, a B+ in Constitutional Law, and a B+ in Torts for a total of a 3.2.

As a consequence, it is a little bit hard for me to claim that I know what helped me and what didn't with regards to how I prepared before or throughout the semester.

My 0L prep: I bought E and Es for Tort law and Contracts since I didn't know what classes I would have. Once I found out I focused mainly on the Torts E and E. I also listened to the Sum and Substance audio lectures for torts. My goal was to be able to take practice tests early in the semester in at least one class. I read Getting to Maybe. I also learned to touch type over the summer before law school.

Preparation during the semester: I was fairly busy just reading and rereading the texts, as well as outlining. As a consequence, I did not begin taking practice tests any where near as early in the semester as I had hoped. However, I still ended up going through quite a few. My Torts professor made all of his past exams available. I took all of them, using their model answers and comparing answers to some of them with my peers. In Constitutional Law, I took the three practice exams which my professor made available as well as others from other professors. In Civil Procedure my professor did not give us an old exam so I tried other professor's exams and also just spent a lot of time going over my class notes and re-reading cases as well as looking at other people's outlines who had taken him and trying to incorporate any nuggets of their wisdom into my own outline and memory.

What I think probably worked?

First of all, it is pretty clear that not much worked very well.

Typing Practice: I would say that learning touch typing was very important to me not doing substantially worse. It is hard to make any claims for sure, but in Civil Procedure where we did not have a word limit most people seemed to have typed a lot. I felt like mine was on the short side, but probably more because I never felt like I had a great grasp on the material no matter how much I studied. I would not have wanted to compound that by also having had to struggle to literally type the exam. Most of my fellow students seem to type faster than me(I now type about 70 words per minute max and probably more like 50 when I am composing the sentences rather than just copying). However, at a certain point I am sure there are diminishing marginal returns on investment in typing. I think that it is worth learning to touch type before law school if you don't know how. I further think that whenever you type notes up for an outline or work on a legal practice assignment you should consciously maintain this skill.

Substantive 1L prep:

I had read the E and E and listened to the sum and substance lectures on Torts before 1L. I felt much more comfortable in that class. I also had a fairly good exposure to American history and the Constitution before 1L which I think led me to be fairly comfortable in Constitutional Law. In contrast, I felt lost and adrift for most of the semester in Civil Procedure. As a consequence of this, I struggled through Civil Procedure readings and instead of using the time which I had saved in Torts and Constitutional Law to practice exam taking early in the semester, I spent it on trying to understand Civil Procedure. Consequently, I don't really think that the 0L prep ended up helping me all that much. However, if someone were to actually dedicate themselves to it and then to practice exam taking once in law school, I think that it could help.

Non-substantive 1L Prep:

While the prevailing view is that reading Getting to Maybe is about the only thing that you should do prior to law school, I think that is pretty much backwards. I read Getting to Maybe and listened to the LEEWS audio tapes over the summer. It was basically impossible to practice anything in them without having something to practice on. This meant that I don't think that I necessarily gained all that much from them. I think that they are more useful once you actually have something to apply them to.

My Recommendations based on my 1L experience:

0L Prep: I think that if I were to decide how to prep for 1L again, I would read supplements for all of my 1L classes(or just the first semester classes if I knew what they were early enough). I wouldn't be trying to learn everything perfectly since you don't know if your prof and casebook are going to agree on every element of a tort with your supplement. However, I would try to get the gist. I would go through the E and E questions and such.

If I couldn't touch type, I would definitely still dedicate some time to working on that.

1L prep: I would do the readings and outlining and all the other normal 1L stuff. However, I would hopefully do it a little faster and more easily. I would try not to worry about cold calls or really focus on them. I also would as I think I did, still participate a fair bit in class and attend office hours regularly. Having a relationship with the professor is important even though grading is blind.

Mainly, I would try to practice exam taking very early, taking about 1 exam per class every week rather than trying to cram them in at the end as I ended up doing. (This semester, that is basically what I am going to try to do, except that I need to read the supplements while doing my work for each class, while applying for jobs(which is a little more frantic with my grades), and still won't be able to start any practice exams for at least a month.

Other Lessons Here:

First of all, my law school related advice obviously is not that of an expert and all the old guides and stuff from TLS are probably better.

Second, it really is true at least in my experience that LSAT has very little ability to predict your grades. I had LSAT high of 180 on my retake which is of course pretty much as above the median as you can get. From the beginning of class, I have nonetheless found my peers to be every bit as smart and as hardworking as me which is pretty much as I expected. They just for whatever reason either were not as good at the LSAT or alternatively didn't put as much of a systematic effort into improving on the LSAT as 7sage enabled me to. That worked to my benefit by ensuring that I got my scholarship and therefore have a tolerable level of debt if I either chose not to try to get Big Law or if by virtue of grades and other circumstances(for example a recession) I end up not exactly having a choice in the matter.

So don't go to a school thinking that you will be able to get good grades based on an above median LSAT or work ethic and that those grades will make the experience worthwhile. Go if because of a combination of your drive to be a lawyer and how good a financial deal you can get, you will be happy with your decision even if you end up with below median grades and maybe a below median(financially) career outcome.

I'm still happy with my decision to come here and will be as long as I end up with some legal job because with basically any job(as long as I find one) I can pay back my small debt pretty quick. If I like said job, I can stick with it and have opened a door that was not available to me before law school. If not, I won't be trapped in that job or the law forever or even for more than a couple years. Additionally, while I felt like I was struggling in Civ Pro, I have generally liked being in law school because the classes have been interesting and at least at Michigan the people have by and large been very friendly and nice. I have made friends who I hope to have for life and am overall very happy to be here.

That brings us to the last point:

Some of you may have heard of the notable exception to the general niceness of the people at Michigan Law School. https://abovethelaw.com/2018/12/law-school-student-mocks-the-disabled-because-why-not/

https://www.reddit.com/r/LawSchool/comments/a8h96r/dont_be_this_stupid/

This student has lost the respect of everyone in the law school who knew who he was(and law schools especially Michigan where a large share of the 1L class stays in the Lawyer's Club are pretty close knit communities). He probably would have trouble transferring since the Dean would certainly tell any other school that asked of the situation if asked why he was transferring down or parallel. Therefore, he is likely very much alone and deservedly so. Having got my own generally discouraging grades today, I can tell you that it is the friendships with classmates which make them tolerable. So if you happen to have vile and unmerited negative feelings about your classmates at whatever school you eventually attend, you should get some help, you should not drink to excess, you should not tell people about them other than a counselor, and you should definitely not send out an email to the whole school disparaging students who are part of your community.

The school is taking some actions in response, but has generally dealt with it quietly(perhaps because they are worried about publicity or perhaps because they are worried about the student's mental health and substance abuse problem). They are also taking positive steps. At 4 today we have a(previously scheduled speaker) for Martin Luther King Jr. day which is focused in part on disabilities and there is a mandatory event on Friday.

If anyone has any questions about Michigan Law, 1L, 0L prep, or my experience in law school so far, feel free to ask. Obviously I am pretty busy and am going to get more busy as a result of my need to improve my grades and expand my job search. I justified taking the time to post this on the basis that I was too stressed out by seeing my grades to get much done for a couple hours anyway. However, I will check back and respond to any questions sooner or later.

Episode 10 just released!

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Hey 7sagers,

I am interested in looking into getting a tutor for the LSAT. Before I do so, I was wondering if you have gotten an LSAT tutor, how have your experiences be? What areas did you use them to help you in? How have they helped you improve your mark?

For me I am looking into getting a Tutor for LR & RC, study plans, etc.

Any stories, tips and info are recommended.

I got my LSAT score today, and writing another thank you post! 7Sage really works if you combine it with hard work and dedication.

I haven't participated in the discussion forums much but I have read a lot of your posts. During my studies what kept me going was hearing people's struggles and success stories. Today I'm sharing mine. The LSAT didn't come naturally to me. My first diagnostic four years ago was somewhere in the low 150's. I studied for 4 months and gave up, deciding that I would pursue a career in Accounting instead. While my chosen profession gave me lots of room to grow and provided a comfortable salary, I always had this feeling that I wasn't satisfied and something was missing. I felt like I had given up on my dream.

When I turned 27, I asked myself if I would be happy being an accountant until I retired; the answer was a resounding "NO". So I made a promise to myself that that year I would take the LSAT. I gave myself a year to study thinking I'll have lots of time. In reality, it took more than a year to do this while holding a full-time job that can at times be demanding. The journey was also not as linear as I thought. There were many times where I thought I had good grasp of the test only to have another weak area come out of the woodwork.

For those of you wondering what my process was after the CC, I fool-proofed logic games using Pacifico's method on PTs 1-35 then started doing timed PTs once a week and blind-reviewing. This only got me so far because my issue was timing - I had difficulty getting to all of the questions in 35 minutes, especially for LG and LR. So I focused on honing my skills on these two sections by developing habits that I know would help me get through the questions faster. For LG, I split the gameboard whenever possible. Even if I didn't have all the worlds figured out, being able to focus on just one or two sub gameboards helped immensely. I also did "if" questions first and left MBT/MBF/CBT questions to the end. There are also situations where you just need to crunch out a world fast and it's better to just do it rather than stare at the question for a minute trying to find an "easy way out". For LR, I learned to recognize when to skip questions. This sounds way simpler than it actually is. I had to do over 10 PTs before I had a good sense when a question was just taking too long and it was better to skip. I also drilled specific types of questions that constantly tripped me up and wrote detailed responses to the logic behind the right answer and the logic behind why the wrong answers were wrong.

By November 2018 I felt like I was ready. I was PT'ing in the 165-168 range. When I took the November exam it felt great, everything went smoothly and I thought it was a pretty easy test. So when I got a 164 I was devastated. I felt like I had been deceived because the test felt so easy. I reviewed my responses and realized I got a lot of easy questions wrong. I'm not sure if it was nerves or if I was just careless. For the next two months I kept on doing timed sections and fine-tuning those test-taking habits.

When I sat for the January 2019 test, it felt worse than November. Despite all my efforts I felt really rushed and one experimental RC (which I thought was real) really crushed me. I ended up not finishing the LG section and one LR section, blindly guessing on three questions. I was ready to cancel my score because I was sure I did worse but I kept reminding myself that the admissions committee only looks at your highest score. So even if I did do worse, I still had a 164. I got the email this morning on my way to work and I had to resist immediately opening it until I got to my office. I was shocked to see my score of 169! Out of the 27 PT's I took in the past year I only scored above 168 on four of them. And considering I missed three questions, I was not expecting this.

I credit my improvement on a few factors. The long study period definitely helped. As others have mentioned, this test is like a marathon. You cannot cram for it. I found doing one PT a week and reviewing for 1-2 hours every day helped solidify the logic to a point where I don't need to think about it much. Practice is key, especially with logic games. Do as many as you can as often and consistently as possible. I found even taking a one or two week break significantly affected my performance. Reading comprehension was always my strongest section so I didn't focus too much on this as I started off getting on average 3-4 questions wrong.

Lastly, my advice is to have faith. The path to progress is not always linear and that's okay. Find what works for you and makes you improve. I know how devastating it can be to study so much and work so hard only to get the same score or do worse than before, but each wrong answer is a chance for you to do better. If you change your outlook and frame of mind it can pay dividends.

I wish the best of luck to all future LSAT students and prospective lawyers. I'll be (hopefully) heading to my top-choice law school in Canada this September and want to thank 7Sage and this community for being supportive throughout this whole process. Even though I studied alone, it never really felt that way because of all of you. Thank you.

I am finding that only a few of the answers I got wrong were in fact circled ones from when i took the PT, and most of the answers I got wrong weren’t even circled to begin with? I’m afraid either my confidence is too high or something is very wrong with my reasoning that I don’t even doubt myself with these particular questions. Thoughts? Any feedback is appreciated.

What's the best location to take my LSAT?

Fordham

New York Law School

Bergen County Community College

Seton Hall

Any help would be appreciated!

I just took the LSAT at CUNY Law. It was...ok. Comfortable chairs and tables, but a lot of construction outside. A siren went off in the construction site next door about every 5-10 minutes. Also, the elevated 7 train is right there, so you hear that too. And, it's right in the middle of a heavy foot traffic zone so you can hear people talking outside, dogs barking, etc. It would be better if the rooms were soundproof, like they are at Fordham Law, where I took the July test and didn't hear a live concert that was right outside the door at Lincoln Center. I would do Fordham again, but they're not offered as a testing center in January. Has anybody ever taken it at Queens College? If so, how was it? I obviously wouldn't give a full recommendation for CUNY Law (even though it has rave reviews on various sites, but perhaps this was old when Long Island City wasn't one big construction site). Thanks for any feedback! (PS, I also took it at Wagner College at Staten Island and could give feedback on that).

Episode 14 is here!

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The last few weeks waiting for my score I was sure I did poorly. The test was hard in my opinion compared to the majority of the 30 others I have taken. Well, I opened the email and saw an amazing score. I had gone from the low 140s to the high 150s. A 17 point increase to be exact. It was just shy of my best PT score. I cannot thank 7Sage enough!!!

Wow, LSAC is adding another fee! Lol. I was just playing around on the site, thinking about if I wanted to take a last ditch shot at another LSAT for scholarship purposes, and saw this when you click through the June registration:

Notice starting with June 2019 LSAT: The writing section will be separate from the LSAT starting with the June 3, 2019 test. This change will result in greater convenience and flexibility for test takers as the testing date will be shorter, the essay will be typed rather than handwritten, and it can be completed at a time and place of the test takers' choosing. By registering for the June LSAT, candidates will be automatically eligible to complete the writing section as of the date of the LSAT and up to one year thereafter. Candidates are only required to have one essay on file to complete their Law School Reports. Essays completed during previous LSAT administrations will still be valid for use in Law School Reports. There will be an additional fee of $15 for each administration of LSAT Writing.

The way I read this, I think that the LSAT Writing section will be included in your registration fee once with the new method (doing it on your own time after the test), and then if you take the LSAT again but opt for another writing section, it will be an additional $15 fee. Good news: you only have to do it once! Bad news: personally, I don't enjoy the thought of basically writing yet another application essay. The standard will likely be higher and schools will probably now pay much more attention to them, since you aren't doing it at the very end of a grueling test under timed conditions. Now, you will really have to step up your game and write a good essay. Also, of course LSAC found another way to add a fee hahah.

(Ok but now that I am re-reading it, I can't tell if the writing section is included in the June registration, or if you do have to pay the $15 to take it. Not totally clear to me. But, be aware of the additional fee!)

I've narrowed the choice down to:

CUNY School of Law

Pace University

Fordham Law

I would appreciate any comments on your experience(s) at the above testing centers! Trying not to think about how my testing site choice will determine if I get paper or digital test.....

I'm currently working as a software engineer( more like an algorithm engineer), and I decided to apply next cycle. I got a decent LSAT score on Jan test, so I didn't worry about test preparation. The thing is my current job is nothing related to practicing law. I want to be a patent lawyer after law school, so I searched online about patent agent job( and also patent assistant). However, the salary for inexperienced patent agent is only one third of my current salary. TBH, I didn't care about money. I had enough saving. How important is work experience related to job hunting after law school? Is it stupid to give up my current job for less lucrative position?

Thanks for your advice.