I've been having a lovely discussion in another thread and I happen to be on a very strict time table that can't be altered so naturally the subject arises, to postpone, is that possible? Unfortunately I pretty much have to start in the fall of '19. Having started in October I'm taking the January LSAT and hoping I score high enough that a mediocre GPA with an excellent addendum and some exquisite personal statements and LORs and the moral purity of my intent will be enough to compensate for the lateness in the cycle. So naturally, maybe, but maybe I don't get admitted anywhere in the top 14. Then what?

I'd love to attend pretty much anywhere, though. I'm thinking T14 or bust because all of the information that can be found in a cursory search says a JD from essentially anywhere else may as well be your corpse, as our rarer monsters are, painted on a pole and underwrit, "Here may you see the effect of irrecoverable debt."

My desire for the T14 in this sense is entirely practical; prestige has no effect on me. Of course some of these places like Yale are dream places because of the rare opportunities they represent and how Harvard and Yale have a couple of the largest libraries on Earth. Yet the Socratic method works as well at any ABA school, does it not?

My grandfather was an attorney. For undergraduate he went to Columbia. For law school he went to Fordham, where he got his JD in 1950 at the age of 29. He went on to have a terrific career and life, and died a well loved old man. His command of conditional logic was a thing of divine elegance. However, 7sage says they're 29-37 on US News in the last few years. Could things really have changed so dramatically in only 68 years that I may as well not go to Fordham if admitted? Where would I find the data?

I mean, I figure, I'm legacy, they have a great location, my grandfather always spoke very highly of them and their requirements are marginally less strict than the T14. I don't doubt my ability to top my class at this point in life. Yet would this be to acquire a hopeless debt?

Where is the exact line past the T14? Seems like UCLA is sometimes 15. Being one below the T14 couldn't be a death sentence, could it? Also their admissions policy seem friendly to me for a variety of reasons. I'd prefer to be anywhere in Pennsylvania to North Carolina but Duke is 11 and PennState is 74! I mean, University of Pennsylvania, hope for a miracle, but, woof.

I’m taking the January test and in full swing of my PTs. What I’m finding is more recently, I’m getting easier questions wrong because my thought process is something like, “oh no, this question couldn’t possibly be this easy” or “what am I missing? This has to be a trick question.” And then I’m getting these easy questions wrong. Is there anything I can do to combat this?

I am thinking of seating for the June 2019 Exam. Does anyone has taken the exam in Georgetown or Albany? If yes, how was your experience at these centers.

Hi,

I've foolproofed almost all the games from PT1~current, with a few remaining fresh PT's.

I've done at least 2,000 games. I have no problem meeting the target time when I repeat games.

But whenever I face a new LG section, I go anywhere from -8 to -10. My cold score for LG was -10 (PT68), which I took two years ago. It's so strange that I have made almost zero improvement, although my conditional logic is much more solid than it was two years ago.

I know that there are patterns on the LG, but I have serious issues registering new rules into my head and pushing out inferences under time pressure. My brain really,really suffers whenever I see new logic games.

I've been doing almost only LG prep intensively for the last two months, but my LG performance is actually getting worse.

At this point, I'd be very happy with a -5 on the real thing.

Any help or encouragement will be appreciated.

Thank you.

Hi fam and happy holidays to those celebrating!

I had a quick notation question if that's alright? So coming from a formal logic background and Powerscore tutoring, I was always told to notate an "and" statement like so:

..........B

A→ +

..........C

However, while I was foolproofing the Logic Games from PT 70 I came across J.Y's method/style:

A→B

↘ C

I do remember this notation from my 7 sage days years ago and more recently from some lessons upon my return, so I tried it. No surprise, it made the game infinitely easier (Game 2 for reference).

My question is this: Are there situations where one style is better than the other and if so what are they?

Thanks for your time!

Hi All!

I’m planning to take the January test. I’ve already postponed several times (I’ve been postponing since June) and want to finally get it over with. I’ve been studying consistently for quite a while and have jumped from a 148 to 165+. My goal is 170+ and I think I still have room for improvement (especially because I just recently started properly BR-ing everything, even doing written explanations for my thought process). I’ll be graduating from a top 10 undergrad (with a 3.94 GPA) in May and then plan to take a gap year to work and apply to law school next cycle during my gap year. I went through the 7sage curriculum but also did Powerscore Bible stuff, had a tutor, and took a class. I’ve been doing lots of drills and now have recently moved on to individual timed sections. On the sections, I’ve averaging -0/-1 on LG, -2/-3 on RC, and -4/-5 on LR. I think that’s pretty good and am able to focus quite well during individual sections. However, whenever I have to take a practice test, I freak out. I find any excuse to postpone it and then when I actually sit down to do it, I feel incredibly anxious and unmotivated. I’m trying to do 6 section practice exams now in order to build up endurance, but I’m not sure if that’s the right approach. Maybe I’m just burnt out...any thoughts or advice? Similar experiences? Should I take the March test? Thank you!!

How many LR questions do top scorers completely skip in their Round 1? How many do they circle due to under confidence/uncertainty (but still chose an AC) and then return to?

For me, in a LR section, I usually completely skip around 5-6 questions in my round 1. So I end up finishing my LR round 1 pass at about 27 minutes, and I have about 8 minutes to go back and finish those 5-6 questions I completely skipped.

Those 5-6 questions I completely skipped are usually long formal logic questions, long parallel reasoning questions, tough sufficient assumption questions which I suspected need a lot logic mapping, or questions I read the stimulus twice and didn't understand and skipped in about 1 minute.

In addition to those 5-6 questions I completely skipped, I also have around 2-3 questions I circled and filled in an answer choice but was uncertain because I was down to 2 answer choices (one AC at 60% confidence level and another at 40%, and I filled in the 60% confidence level AC).

Those 2-3 questions I also wanted to get a second look at, but I often can't/run out of time because I'm rushing to complete those 5-6 questions I completely skipped.

Am I completely skipping too many? Any suggestions or advice would be appreciated. Thank you!

Hi Everyone! I finished 7sage CC at the end of Nov and took a post-CC diagnostic. I have been studying on and off for logic games proofing (only a few days worth) and have decided to push my Jan 2019 LSAT to March. I'm trying to figure out what I want to do between now and March but I'm kind of lost. My post-CC diagnostic is between 10-20 points from my goal score and I noticed that timing is an issue for me too. I have only taken 1 PT since the CC, tried to begin foolproofing, got tied up doing job interviews and I guess now I'm at square one again. However, I am ready to hit the ground running again and especially now that I am giving myself more time.

Q: Should I take a few more PTs now to determine where I'm at curriculum-wise before jumping into logic game proofing or just go right into LG proofing?

With a little more time, I can take more PTs before the real deal but I'm not going to have time to commit to a robust logic games proofing schedule (section a day, Pacifico's method, one whole month).

Q: Is it possible to get the benefits of foolproofing from just doing the logic games from the PTs I take? JY's or Pacifico's Method?

I also start taking classes at the beginnng of January, have a two-week sping break in March and the week after that I have the exam. I made sure that my schedule wasnt going to be to rigorous to make time for the LSAT but I see these three months as my "PT and rigourous BR" phase of my studying (1-2 test per week for 12 weeks). My post-CC diagnostic was pretty average but it may or not be the best indication for where I am right now (those were the first and only-timed sections/questions I've done since I started 7Sage).

Q: Is more or less PTs in my situation better? Timing is an issue for me, but it's not like I scored a 180 on the BR of that post-CC PT.

So what's the best course of action I should take? I plan to reboot my LSAT studying on Sunday (Dec. 23).

P.S. I had a chance to checkout the Post-CC webinar and that was pretty helpful too but wondering if anyone has any advice to drive home, add or tweak from what was advised.

How long does it take for LSAC to process international transcripts?

It's been over two months for me. Two long months riddled with complications and no proper responses. I sent in my transcripts and heard back weeks later about them needing my degree certificate as well. Sent that in urgently under a week and emailed them to check if they had gotten it since I hadn't heard back. They said they're unable to answer since they receive lots of documents every day and that I should wait for the transcript to be processed to my file. Three weeks pass by again and I mail them asking how much longer I need to wait. To which I get a reply, days later, that they're still waiting for my degree certificate! I emailed them about the confusion, to which there was no reply so I called them up and after a long, gruelling conversation I was told they've received my degree certificate they just can't seem to locate it. They were supposed to get back to me today and they didn't.

Looks like my application's slated for January now. This is so disappointing.

Any international student listening, how was your experience?

Recently graduated. Started studying in October with this course but only a couple hours here and there a week. Took the LSAT in November and got a148. I plan on on studying full time for the March test. Is that enough time to get into the 160s?

Salutations!

So when I first saw the pencil threads here and at TLS my impression was that they were jokes entirely. But as a result of them I did notice that the videos of folks trying the logic games here do show an expensive pencil, they say Staedtler Wopex on them and I happen to have heard of that brand. In contrast all the pencils I have here do not have a brand that I've heard of because they were less than ten cents each, and not being a graphite artist or technical sketcher I've never had a reason to have quality graphite.

So, it did make me curious, does 7sage just happen to have oddly artistic grade pencils around or does a high quality pencil actually give you a bit of precious extra time on bubbling? I asked 7sage directly but the staffer there said to ask here, and encouraged me to become socially involved here as well.

I'm taking the January '19 LSAT incidentally so it will still be scantron. This is incidentally the only one I can take, postponement is impossible. I've had only the three months before to prepare and I just have 7sage starter. I wish I could postpone but I was displaced from my industry and home in California wine country by the Tubbs and Atlas Fires. I've been living with my parents and fiance since, trying to find a new, less flammable career. It only occurred to me in mid-October, my grandfather was an attorney, how might I do on the LSAT? So I took a practice test to see how I might do. Although my overall score was only 160 I did get -0 RC, and I really loved taking the exam, so I've been crunching 7sage videos at 2.4x and logic games ever since. I've never had any previous exposure to conditional logic, except, as I realised in retrospect, in my grandfather's sense of humor. Learning it since has been one of my greatest pleasures thus far. I've always been rather good at argumentation but conditional logic is a whole other level of perception, my experience of the universe has been altered irrevocably.

After noticing I was still confused (thank you Eliezer Yudkowsky) about certain principles of the examination in spite of having covered all of the materials on Khan Academy I tried the free trial here. When JY Ping in his description of the Blind Review said "[. . .] Your aim is true understanding [. . .]" I became enraptured in the curriculum and immediately purchased the Starter package, the most I could afford. This in combination with 7sage's assertion that law school is a more difficult challenge than the LSAT itself has had me exhilarated. Sharpen my mind, O grind stone! Rend confusion from the fat of my brain, O great Socratic axemen!

But yes, unfortunately I simply must begin in the fall of '19 regardless of how it goes. My situation cannot wait. I'm doing logic games over and over again as prescribed by 7sage's Fool-Proof Guide to Perfection and noticing rapid improvement. After the New Year I'll just be doing as many Practice Tests as I can before the 26th without experiencing diminishing returns and fatigue, on this point I'm sure I can do more than average for a variety of reasons each of which are matters of protracted discussion. Then I'll just see how it goes.

I worked 12 hours a day 6 days a week at a winery in Napa and I've been studying that way since mid-November, but I've been crunching the fundamentals and the games. I haven't taken a new practice test to see how 7sage has helped me yet. I can't wait, though.

Existentially anxious, though! Since yeah, it's Fall '19 or bust and T14 or bust. I mean, I'll be applying to some safety schools since my overall undergraduate GPA was 3.15. Though my average for the last two years of it is way better, I struggled with severe depression and other health and mental health issues associated with an utter lack of structure in childhood, something I've made dramatic strides in since. I graduated in 2012 though and my work experience since then is a wild ride of exotic types of labor, so, hopefully that'll matter less especially if I can pull off a 173-180. Also as a school of theater some of the grades were entirely subjective. I'm hoping if I really ace the LSAT and write an interesting enough application I can sway Yale, but then of course there's the probability I won't get in anywhere in the T14. I know if I had done any college lately I'd have a 4.0 but, I haven't.

Although, as to how far down past the T14 one can go and still not be indebted to an unemployable degree, I don't exactly know. I'd love to know more about this since, obviously a safer range of schools and a wider variety of places to live is better.

One thing that might help my situation is my intent, I noticed a few schools have debt forgiveness for people working in human rights or the public sector. My fiance grew up in poverty and really knows how to live well on a limited budget and neither of us have any special material needs. In fact we've at times roamed penniless between agricultural volunteer opportunities in the most rugged conceivable conditions. I can trod through several feet of livestock effluent with a hay bale on my back so I can certainly make a modest salary.

So I may certainly be interested in something like that, the only difficulty there is that my basic intent is to do the greatest possible moral good I may, like anyone, and not having a great familiarity with the industry of law such as it is constituted presently, I don't necessarily know which parts of the field that is. International human rights sounds like it'd involve a lot of moral good but I don't know that. It attracts my interest because human rights violations internationally is one of the primary focuses of my vocational reading. I'm revolted by the great number and frequency of them, and especially how many of them are directly caused by the United States government, regardless of who is in charge. As to what I can do about that with a JD from one of many schools each of which educated several politicians, some of whom are directly responsible for much of these moral horrors is, unclear. So far I only know I love the process.

I don't know how this ended up sprawling so much, sorry. I should probably get back to logic games. Incidentally I notice a lot of people saying "Fool-proofing" as a verb, I think because of the document "Fool-proof Guide to Perfection on Logic Games." Interesting that it developed that way. The language instinct is fascinating.

Oh, random thing! I had a previous thread about my confusion with "or." As someone very language oriented I had always understood or as biconditionally exclusive and it was screwing me up. I've since found it helps to think that "or" in natural language is not generally equivalent to the inclusive disjunction A ∨ B in formal logic, but that on the LSAT, it is.

For causation logic, I know for strengthen questions, there are a few ways to strength an argument

But does "No Cause, No effect" also strengthen?

And similarly for weaken question,

does "no cause, effect happens" -- weaken? Couldn't there be another cause that is accounting for that effect, while also still allowing for the original cause to still cause the effect?

For example, Doing bicep curls causes you to grow muscle.

Would an answer explanation of "He didn't do bicep curls but still grew muscle" weaken that argument? I would think not, because there are other ways you can grow muscle, like doing pushups, etc.

Any clarification or explanation on such causation logic and ways to strengthen/weaken causation would be appreciate.d Thank you!

So we've tossed this around on a couple of different threads, but I wanted to put this up as a new one, just in case it catches anyone's eye who missed the other posts. A few of us in NYC (mostly downtown, also Queens) are looking to start a new study group, and we're going to start by doing BR on the Nov. test. We're meeting Saturday at the Jefferson Library in the West Village - probably 1-5pm. Please comment and/or join us if this is something you want in on...now or just in general over the next couple of months. So far I love JY's methods and explanations, and like so many on here, I only wish I'd found 7sage sooner. But better late than never on a test we're allowed to retake, right?

Hello! I was originally going to be applying for law school this year but decided to get a master's degree first instead, so I will not be applying until next application cycle. I had already been approved for the LSAC fee waiver, which will expire in August of 2019. I am wondering if any of y'all have experience with renewing your fee waiver? Is it as simple as just reapplying/supplying them with updated tax info in 2019?

Thanks!

For the Northwestern application they have a section that asks, "What are your career interest(s) immediately after law school?" and "What are your long-term career goals?"

I have my interests, but I have no concrete ideas about what exactly I'll be doing after graduation. There is an option to leave this section blank. Will not having an answer put me at a disadvantage? Or at least be looked down upon?

Can anyone shed more light on the GULC part-time application? I've done a bit of research, but I have not been able to find out if full time and part time are separate applications. Can you apply to only one or the other in a cycle, or can you apply to both? Or do you just apply to GULC in one application and then you can decide from there if you want to do full or part time? Sorry if this is posted somewhere but I haven't been able to find it.

So the July 2018 non disclosed test was the February 2014 LSAT. The February 2018 test was the February 2016 test.

So it seems like nondisdisclosed test are around 2/3/4 years older than when they are given. So for the upcoming January 2019 non disclosed test, should we be focusing/prioritizing on PT's in the 2015/2016 range? This would be PT's in the mid to late 70s?

Should we do this as opposed to focus on the very most recent exams (mid 80s)?

(Let's assume we have 5 weeks left to the January test, and we're trying to choose which 5 PT's we are planning to take - mid 70s or mid 80s).

I've heard the more recent PT's have changed. Though I haven't taken PT's from 74-86, so I can't really speak about the more recent changes. Can someone explain the differences between PT's in the early 70s to PT's in the mid 80s?

Is there a big difference btw PT's in the mid to late 70s and PT's in the mid 80s?

If there is a difference, should focus more on PT's in the 70s, since that is what is more likely to be represented on a non disclosed test?

Also, it seems like non disclosed test seem to have had a pattern of kinda weird games. Should we be more intentional in practicing those?

any advice or suggestions would be appreciated. thank you.

Would love any feedback from the most wise and experienced @NotMyName and @"Cant Get Right" !! thank you!!

I don’t see it anyone under the logic games tab. Not sure if my iPad is funky, if I should redownload or if 7Sage just doesn’t update the app for working functionality...

I was wondering how different tier 1, 2, and 3 law schools are academically. Will a t-14 school typically be more difficult than a tier 2 school. If so, how large is the difference? Or is the difficulty level similar, and the prestige is what sets these schools apart? Do people sometimes choose schools based on their teaching styles and how demanding the work load will be? Would it be smart to attend a tier 2 school where you think you can excel, or a top law school where you know you will be overwhelmed.

Hi everyone! I just wanted to let you know that I'm available for more application reviews. I've done a few so far, and they went really well.

-Selene

What is Application Review?

Our goal is to tell you what an admissions officer might think after reading your file. I will review your application (a PDF preview) along with other materials that an admissions committee will see (LSAT history, academic summary, etc.). I will give you feedback in a conversation via the phone or Skype and send you notes after the call.

Who am I?

I worked in law school admissions for fourteen years before coming to 7Sage. You can read more about me (and all of us) here: https://classic.7sage.com/admissions/about-us/

What’s the difference between Admissions Consulting and Application Review?

Admissions Consulting comes with unlimited help on all aspects of your application, including strategy, editorial guidance on every essay, and after-app follow-up (for interviews, letters of continuing interest, etc.). Application Review is a review of a single application.

What do you Get in an Application Review?

I will review each element of your application (essays, resume, addenda, transcripts, letters of recommendation) and give you feedback about how an admissions officer might interpret the information. I will offer recommendations on how to revise your current materials to strengthen your overall application. If you have a proposed school list, we can talk about that as well. I will take notes pinpointing strengths and weaknesses and my recommendations. We will walk through each application piece together in our phone/Skype conversation, and I will email you my review notes afterwards.

How much does it cost?

$499.

What do you need to do before you use this service?

You need to write all of your essays, have PDFs of all your academic credentials, fill out an application via LSAC, and upload all of your attachments. You should be ready to hit “submit” before you buy this.

If you’ve already applied, I can give you a post-mortem.

Who should NOT use this service?

Don’t purchase this if you plan to submit your application tomorrow. I may advise you to revise or rewrite large portions of your application.

How do you purchase?

Email editors@7sage.com with the subject line “Application Review” for a reservation. We’ll give you a start date. If that date works for you, you can hold the spot by purchasing the service through a link that we’ll pass along.

So I was looking at LSAC's academic summary for me, and noticed that it looks like an entire year is missing from my undergrad --- which is the same year I did a study abroad. My UG transcript lists my pass/fail (which is how it transferred in)...but now seeing the year gone in LSAC does this mean I need to get a transcript from them? Doing so might really delay my application submission. Would love input. Thanks!

I received a call yesterday in the early morning from Washington University in St. Louis. The caller congratulated me on my acceptance to the law school. However, I never received an email or other form of acceptance confirmation. Should I be concerned?

I’m a slow starter and I found that if I don’t do some warm up questions before a PT I won’t be able to get to the last 5-6 questions of the first section. My warm up routine has been: one game (doesn’t have to be new), 10 LR questions (new), and 1 set of RC passage + questions (new). I time myself when I warm up. I found that except for LG, doing old questions just won’t warm me up the same way new questions do.

This routine is enough to warm me up but the whole thing can take me almost 40 minutes depending on how groggy I am in the morning and can eat up my energy during the actual test. I read some old threads and saw ppl doing just games and a few LR questions. But I want to be prepared if the first section happens to be RC(!!!).

I’m wondering what worked for you guys? Any info will be much appreciated!

Hey everyone, so I've gotten out the bulk of my applications but I still want to submit more. I'm honestly just waiting on my next few paychecks. It's difficult to afford all these applications especially during the holidays. So would applying late December early January put me at a disadvantage? Should I just put the rest of my apps on a credit card? Please let me know if I should be submitting my apps asap.

I've prepared lsat for two months, i studied all the 7sage courses, some of the trainer courses. But i still couldn't see any improvement on my test score. I was stuck under 150 in my recent timed 4 PT. Without time limit, my PT score is between 155-160. My friend suggest me to take 1 PT everyday and review it. I can do that, but i couldn't see any improvement if keep doing so.

LR is my frustrated part. I watched all the course and thought i can improve a lot. But the truth is I can only get 8-13 right of each LR section. Meanwhile i will left 5-6 questions unfinished and even not read. So, the skip strategy almost doesn't applies to me. Since no matter how i skip, i still couldn't finish the questions. Most of the time, when i read the stimulus, i need to refer back to former sentences over and over again to understand the stimulus. It costs me a lot of time. Blind review is also let me angry. First, there always five choices i haven't review and to be wrong. Second even when i reviewed the questions, there're still 3-5 my reviewed answer choice still be wrong. I can understand all the explanations through video or discussion forum. But next time, i still be wrong which make me hopeless.

RC is frustrated as well. Sometimes, i can get 12-14 right this section with a whole passage left unread. In the beginning, i tried to read and whole passage before answering the questions, but it usually take 8 minutes to read each passage and turn out to be a lower correction rate. Now, i skip all the details only read the core sentences, it takes less time, but i still cannot finish the last passages.

Game is bit less than the other two sections. I can get 15-21 right in this section. There's no game i cannot solve after i watched the video. However, there are three big problems. First, i can solve doesn't mean i won't stuck. I stuck a lot on most of the games.

Second, i habitually misread or interpret the stimulus and choose the wrong answers. As a result, i miss 3-4 questions every section in this way. Third, when i try to slow down and make sure my understanding is right, i spent a lot of time and only deduct the wrong questions down to 2-3 of each section. And the result is i may not have time to proceed the last game.

Another problem is i have little sense of the time. Sometimes i feel i was fast, and only stuck a little. The truth is I'm too slow. Anyone can help me a little more about any of the question i met. I'm not clever, but i'm very diligent. And i only aim 150 for the time being.