I am freaking out right now. I've been studying for about 5 months now and since taking the September LSAT, I was scoring at a 171 average timed (range between 169-173). Over the past week I've been consistently getting between 165-169. I don't know what to do! I've taken almost all of the PTs so even if I skip out on the Dec LSAT and take an ENTIRE year off my life (at HUGE opportunity cost -- I don't understand how people can be so cavalier about it), I don't have enough materials to continue studying so I don't know how much it would even help. Anyone else experiencing this? Any words of advice?

So, we go through the entire Core Curriculum, we quiz, drill, answer the questions, BR our work, then review our BR--then we have all of this paper and notes for PTs 1-35. Then what do you do when you need those notes for shattering thought processes going through each PT in order to increase our scores going forward?

Do you keep it all for reviewing often when you're going through each PT? (Maybe this is the BR of that PT that I don't quite understand yet, since I haven't done it yet). When do you come back to some of the lessons and those markups?

Do you keep all of the quizzes, drills, etc. (mine kinda look like Jackson Pollock paintings---I do try to be efficient since I'm identifying intuitions, etc.) so you can review them EACH, as you progress through all of the PTs until the most recent administration is turned into a fresh PT, and then ready to sit for the LSAT?

I mean, how the heck do you all keep track of EVERYTHING? And how often does everyone refer back to EVERYTHING done/learned so far?

I'm starting to see patterns in questions, and assume this will gather in quantity the more PTs I do, but how do you possibly know which shattered thinking you shouldn't repeat?? And worse, when and where that shattered thinking started?

I suppose what I'm asking is: when/how do you know you've shattered a bad habit? Do your scores increase?

Am I supposed to wade through the mountain of paper and previously-done quizzes and drills each time I need to find what I'm doing wrong? How the heck do you catalog it all?

I'm still trying to make sense of how to retain so much of the information, and I'm just finishing the MSS section. :/ (Of course, now I realize why we need so long to study for this bedamndable test).

I know I can refer back to all of the awesome CC lessons, and my notes on each, and SHOULD refer back as often as is necessary, but damn, this is a bunch of info to absorb. If you start a new section each day, how do you keep the info in your head from the previous section--days, weeks, and months later?

I'm a little overwhelmed at the moment, and I've been at this for some months now, obviously, not long enough. (thank goodness I took y'all's advice and withdrew from Saturday's sit.) >__<

Any suggestions and direction are appreciated. THANK YOU! xo *breathing deeply into the paper bag...I have 7 more months of this??*

Just as the title says---

I think it is listed in the thing we can bring but just wanted to make sure...

and anyone actually use it?

Should I take another prep test tomorrow morning before the Saturday exam? I took one on Tuesday and subconsciously feel as if I take another tomorrow I might risk being burnt out for the exam? Would I be better off just doing individual sections instead of a full length exam?

Thanks...and good luck to you all. God Speed.

I have heard from a few people that they got away with not including the courses they have taken at CC's. I know withdrawing isn't generally punitive but I do have a W. What are my chances with getting away with not including my CC transcript?

Unfortunately I was not able to take advantage of @"J.Y. Ping" 's BR sessions on 79. Now I am needing some help understanding some things from 79 to clarify my understanding. I feel decent about what I got wrong but I always like J.Y.'s explanation videos because they help cement or expose my learning as necessary. Are there any help places on the web with questions explanations for PT 79 or should I just corner @"Accounts Playable" during his office hours (because no one else will want his time...right?).

This weekend is going to be FUN. December LSAT here we come!

I was offered admission to my top choice school today. I could not have done it without the support and guidance of the 7Sage community. I really didn't think this would happen - thank you SO much 7Sage for preparing me.

Best of luck to everyone waiting on decisions - you got this!!

I figured I'd post this as a discussion rather than a comment on the quiz page since it will be seen by more. I have 2 questions regarding the quiz. The first is about question one which is

A person is not guilty of an offense unless his liability is based on conduct which includes a voluntary act not performed under duress I decided to take the first idea (not guilty), negate it, and make it my sufficient condition. So I have G---->UD/. This translates to english as "a person is guilty of a crime if they were not under duress". The contrapositive would be UD--->G/. This translates back to "if a person was under duress than they are not guilty". JY translated the ideas a G/ for not guilty and LC for liable of conduct. This means his translation was G---->LC as in "if they were guilty they were liable for conduct. Contrapositive would be LC/----> G/ which is of course "if they aren't liable for thier conduct they aren't guilty of the crime". So I'm not really sure why we ignore the not in the 2nd part of the sentence (not under duress) but don't ignore it in the first (not guilty). How do I know when I need to account for this "not" and when I can ignore it?

The second question I had for this quiz is from question 6. That sentence reads as

I won’t stop tickling you on the nose until the leprechauns from my dream stop nibbling my toes with their teeth that have the old fashioned braces to correct their severe overbite, a condition endemic to the Aberdeen leprechaun population, of my dreams. For this one I took the 2nd Idea and made it the sufficient. I translated it to N/ for stop nibbling and then applied to the rule so it became N. Then I took the first part of the sentence and made it T. so N--->T and T/----> N/. This translates to english as "if leprechauns are nibbling, I'm tickling" and the contrapositive would be "If I'm not tickling then the leprechauns aren't nibbling". JY's translation was T--->/L and L---->T/. Again this is totally different than mine and we have ignored the "stop" in the 2nd part of the sentence. I can't seem to figure out why that is. Why can we just chalk that entire 2nd part of the sentence up as an "L" but other times we have to account for the "not", "stops", or "won't"?

Hi Guys,

Week 2 with RC practices. I been doing them along just beginning to learn LG.

So I been doing primarily JY ranking L5 and L4 reading sets. And what I find is the following:

If I take more than 6-8 min on the passage and 6-7 min on questions, I can get an average of -1 on the passage. Never a -0 because the questions are usually very subtle.

But if I take the average reading speed which the average textbook recommend, the mistake obviously goes up.

I don't know what exactly to do with this just because 1) The passage usually require time to understand since it always include a lot of referential phrases, 2) the structure is not clear, 3) the answer choice, which is 1/5, targets a specific sentence in the middle of no where where you have to find it.

So does practice help on this? Should I just continue to focus on with my accuracy oriented practice style until later when PT is up or when I finish the actual learning set?

Your recommendation will be highly valuable.

On my admission ticket it says: "rooms posted on test day" and right underneath it mentions what building the Test is going to take place (I am having the test done at a university). I was wondering if you guys have your exact test location assigned to you yet.

To anyone who took September or June, what were the extra sections? I'm taking the upcoming test and really really hoping it's not RC.

Hey fellow 7sagers : )

I am seeing a lot of posts about people knowing they are not ready for the test but still taking it or realizing by answering their LSAT questions that they do not yet have a good grasp on fundamentals but are still taking the test. So if your average score of past 3-5 correctly timed stimulated practice test is not within plus or minus 5 of your ideal score. This post is for you.

A little background: I was once where you are, not ready for the test, but I was registered. I had already paid the $180 ( or whatever the exorbitant amount they charge us) and quite frankly refused to let my hard earned money go to waste. I mean, $180 is a lot of money! I was determined to at least get "something" out of that money I had already given to LSAC. I reasoned I could get some real time practice about how LSAT really was and somehow that would help me when I was finally able to take the test having studied to my full potential, at a later date of course. But then some "mentors" descended out of nowhere and helped me see where I was going wrong and I hope I can do the same for you and return that favor. So below I have listed five reasons you should not take LSAT this coming Saturday.

Why you should ditch LSAT this weekend :)

#1) Learning from other people who have taken the test before they were ready: It's more effective to learn from other people who have done something similar than to do the same thing and expect different results. When I have asked people who have taken this test before they were ready none of them have yet said to me "That was such an invaluable experience!". On the contrary I mostly hear regrets. I often hear "I wished someone had told me not to take the test. I just wasted my takes. Even though I am now ready, my real lsat score ended up being slightly below what I was scoring on my practice and I wish I had more takes left." You literally just have to ask around to see the regrets in people who took the test before they were ready to know that this idea of using a real take as a practice test is nothing compared to the value of having a few takes left and scoring your ideal score and getting into your dream college. Some people need to take it twice or thrice to just score within their practice range. So please err on the side of caution and give yourself that opportunity.

#2) Don't give your application a weakness it doesn't have yet: When you get down to submitting your applications, which one of us really wants to write about why one of our LSAT score was low?

#3) $180 is actually not a lot of money: Okay It's a lot of money if you think in terms of how most of us have to pinch money so we can work as few hours as possible and study for LSAT as much as we can. But If you take a look at the financial impact a good college can have on our lives, that $180 doesn't seem to be worth it to fuss over.The current lawyer I work for went to T20 law school and can make that much in less than half an hour, and this isn't even big law. So although that $180 seems a lot right now, the opportunities that can come from getting into a top college and having an amazing application which cannot happen without an LSAT score, is worth to lose that $180 now. Lets not throw good money after bad.

#4) That practice we all want to get this Saturday can be achieved in a library with JY's recorded voice as the proctor: is it exactly the same as real time? No. But if you adhere to it and don't cheat yourself, there is not much difference between a real proctored test and JY proctored test. Could bad things happen during the real thing? Yes. But you could prepare yourself for that too by taking it in places where its hard to take the test. The point being you can stimulate real test day, apart from unseen circumstances, pretty accurately. So don't use a real take for practice; use practice test for practice, and real test for when you are really ready.

#5) Maybe I can score a 170 on the real test?!!!!:(/i(/u)> I call this the "I am the Exception" feeling and I think this is actually a big one. Despite the evidence in front of us where our practice scores and our dream scores just do not match, somehow we get convinced we might get that 170 or who knows even that 180 if we just take this test. I think this happens because all us are actually very good students, who get mostly A's, or know we are smart because even when we didn't work hard we still managed to get that high grade. We have by now mastered the art of cramming the day before the test; surely if in college studying the night before could get me A+, I can study this week before the test and beat everybody just like I used to. While it might have worked in college, I am here to tell you sadly LSAT is different. Unlike cramming, LSAT requires us to develop good and efficient habits. It's not something we score on the test day, but something we have already scored in our practice test.

*So unless you actually attended Hogwarts and know some spells to ace this LSAT in a different way, I recommend using your practice test as a guide to know when you are ready. After all, is PT 80 going to be so different from PT 75-79 that your score will jump tremendously? Probably not. Maybe a little if you are lucky like some ( I have yet to hear a more than 5 point jump), but not by a lot.

#6) Confidence: ( I know I said five reasons but its actually six. Five just made for a better Title of the post ;) ) I know from taking enough PT's that confidence can play a big role into the score I am going to get. The more confident I am, the faster I will end up going through questions and finish everything on time. But the funny thing about confidence is that it has to come from ability. If you are not yet able to answer questions correctly and fast, you are either going to be over confident in which you will answer things incorrectly or you are going to be under confident and stressed, and you will also end up answering things incorrectly. Confidence in LSAT is great when it comes from acquired ability, it doesn't work the other way around and it can definitely hinder you if you are not confident because you know you are not ready.

I know this is not the news most of us want to hear, especially when we are registered to take the test in a few days. But I hope this gives you at least a few points to consider. The rest is up to you of course. Good luck in whatever direction you end up going. Much much love.

I would like to add an inspiring story for people who don't want to wait till the next application cycle to take the test:

I once met a Dentist who told me that he waited three years to get into UC San Francisco, which is the #1 Dental School in United States. During those three years he faced constant doubt from himself because of how hard it was for him to score high on that test and the pressure from his family who thought he was just wasting time. But he didn't budge. And now that he has graduated from the top Dental school and makes a lot of money, no one remembers that time. His family doesn't and he certainly doesn't. He is very happy he made that decision and gave himself the best opportunity he could to succeed and he has succeeded.

I wish only success and the best for all of you. Good luck <3

Everyone is nervous about this coming Saturday - right? It's not just me?

I have been studying for at least a year now, and am as prepared as I'll ever be. But I'm still a big pile of nerves going in. Not so much about the exam setting and real test conditions, but for what will actually be on the exam. J.Y. says to stay calm and not panic in the event of an unusual/surprise question, but even if one is to remain calm, you still need to be able to work your way through the question. I can stay calm. But I'm worried about getting "stumped."

Everyone writing the December exam, please share your feelings! I'm so up and down, emotionally, that I can't even sit still. And it's only Tuesday. SOS.

Hey All,

I will be taking the June 2017 LSAT. Currently, the materials I have are LSAT trainer + Bibles + PT 70-79 as well. I am currently finishing my masters and so December is super hectic for me. But I will begin studying January, which gives me a little over 5 months of studying. I plan on studying about 3 hours/6 days for 18 hours. I am stuck between 7sage and taking a class (BluePrint- A friend of mine loved the class and went from a 143 to a 167!). I do get test anxiety so being held accountable in a classroom setting is much more suitable for me at least. But I am still doing the Starter pack with 7sage and maybe upgrading to ultimate.

My goal is a 165-170. I took a pt and got a 151 timed. My UG GPA is sort of on the lower end :( (fooling around as an undergrad) it is a 3.5. My masters GPA is a 3.8 and I know they could care less about this grade or at least its not as important as undergrad. My dream school is George Washington U. and Northwestern ! :D So I am very prepared to start studying. Also, if you live in NY, in the city or lower westchester area, I'd love to study in barnes and noble or Starbucks! My plan is June 2017, However, It will come down to my average scores around the test date meaning I am open to taking the September one instead. We'll see.

Guys I feel like I'm getting sick. I must take the test on Saturday if I want to get in next year. WHAT DO I DO!? :(

Hey guys, I just have a simple question. Im planning on doing about 7 LR questions and an easy game before the test on Saturday and I was wondering if we should warm up outside at the testing center or at home before we leave the house? Also, if anyone can think of any easy Logic game, i'd appreciate it haha. I want something simple on test day just to get my brain going. (Same for LR.) Thanks!

Bring your questions! David, aka Accounts Playable, will be offering office hours this week. David is a wealth of LSAT knowledge, so don't miss the chance to pick his brain!

Office Hours with David

Thu, Dec 1, 2016 6:00 PM - 7:00 PM EST

Please join my meeting from your computer, tablet or smartphone.

https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/257106973

You can also dial in using your phone.

United States +1 (872) 240-3412

Access Code: 257-106-973

First GoToMeeting? Try a test session: http://help.citrix.com/getready

I've just decided to postpone taking the december lsats! I scored a 161 on the september test, after consistently scoring in the high 160s on pts. However while prepering for a retake i broke through the 170s and decided i might as well aim higher!! I'm trying to get my hands on pt c2. Does anyone know where i can find it??

Anyone know where I can find a tutorial on 7sage re: the writing sample?

Hello, so I'm looking for another recommender now and got a reply from one of the profs I contacted and...

He said he is ill (has serious illness he said) now and just got back from hospital.

(He also retired from teaching.)

He was the 2nd best prof I knew and since the best prof I know may not be available, I really hoped that I could get a letter from him.

I don't know...normally I would not ask or bother him but I may not be able to find another prof...

What should I do?

Can I still ask him to write a letter or should I not bother him?

Hey! I'm just trying to get an idea of what information i'll need on test day to fill out the forms properly?

will we get enough time and guidance on this on test day?

I'm sure others are wondering too.

Thanks!

In another thread, about Logical Games, which I didn't want to hijack:

@BinghamtonDave This is a set that doesn't allow an ounce of hesitation or misreading.

Because this is a skill that's absolutely required for success in law school.

Right? ... Right?

And to anyone, including the LSAC, who says, "Maybe not specifically, but LSAT scores correlate well with success in law school," my response is that you do not understand the distinction between necessary and sufficient conditions.

And somewhat separately, but still within this discussion's title: it's 2016 and not only are we taking multiple choice exams on paper, we're writing essays in pencil?! Is meekly accepting being treated like a child -- or a criminal -- a criterion for success in law school?

I have been getting the same consistent scores for over a month now and have been happy with my score, but I took a PT two days ago (two days in a row) and went down 4 points on both of these days..not sure why? i know for a fact im drained but im not too convinced that this is the reason why my score went down two days in a row exactly -4. what do i do up until the test day? I plan on taking two more practice tests (tomorrow and wednesday) but also nervous to see the same low score I got two days ago? i saw on a few forums that its normal to randomly go lower the last week before the lsat but i also saw on other forums that the last 3 PTs is a good representation of what I would be getting on test day

Hey everyone!

I started the core curriculum on Sept. 26th and so far I've only completed about 10 percent of all the curriculum. I'm currently on the Weakening/Causation questions which are giving me a hard time. I'm a junior/senior in undergrad and I'm planning to take the June 2017 exam. However, I feel that I'm moving too slowly because I have to balance out all my other work while putting in 2 to 3 hours 4 to 5 days a week of prep. When I do study, I'm usually doing question problem sets in which I manage to complete only a few because I take a lot of time typing everything up in a word doc while blind reviewing to fully comprehend the problem (which I truly recommend because it really does help with learning). Should I take it slow and keep doing this, or should I just move on to another section and try to finish the core curriculum as my main priority? I have 7 months until the June LSAT, but at this pace it seems as if I'm never going to finish the core curriculum in time to start doing practice tests lol.

I know some of you will tell me to just go at it slowly and take my time and wait until I'm at my target score, even if it means taking a year off after undergrad. I have seriously considered this and it is an actual possibility for me. However, I'm graduating undergrad a bit behind as it is, and delaying law school will only extend my years of schooling into my late twenties which I truly would not like to do (I just want to work!!). What do you guys think?

hello all ,

I've sort of resigned myself to the fact that i probably wont hit my goal score of 158-60 on test day but its to late to postpone.. I'm registered for feb but I'm feeling a little cynical about December. I've already applied to a few schools so I'm sort of locked in.

what would all of you recommend for someone whose scoring 10/23 on LG? a mixed bag of timed games?

most of the time my achilles is simply my nerves. i get paralyzed when i see a hard game and all the fundamentals seem to slip away.

thanks